Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD)

DATE=4/6/2004

TYPE=INTERVIEW

TITLE=LUGAR / IRAQ

NUMBER=3-902

BYLINE=DAVID BORGIDA

DATELINE=WASHINGTON

MR. BORGIDA:

Given the recent brutal killings of American contractors in Fallujah and the latest attacks by armed Shiite groups in Baghdad, I asked him if he was concerned about what might happen in the weeks ahead as preparations continue for the June 30th handover of power to the Iraqis.

SENATOR LUGAR:

Well, how do you know, come June 30th, that a civil war will not occur? After all, we -- that is, the coalition -- has not disarmed all of these militia that these religious groups have in various places. They still are armed and, apparently, ready to fight, as we are finding, they are fighting even the Americans or the Spaniards or the El Salvadoreans, or whoever happens to be in harm's way.

So what I have called for, at least, is a set of hearings on April 20th, 21st and 22nd, in which we are going to examine what the lay of the land is, not only with the administration witnesses -- and hopefully they will be helpful in giving us our own road map of how this might proceed -- but with others who have expressed at least a very knowledgeable skepticism about how things are going and what we must do. And among the things we might need to do is to have more troops on the ground to provide security -- for us, for the U.N., for the Governing Council, for whoever -- because the current chaos is unacceptable.

MR. BORGIDA:

Do you share the view by Senator Biden, as he has written and articulated, that there should be a summit of European leaders to try to move this forward and get a more multilateral approach at the moment?

SENATOR LUGAR:

Well, I have commended Senator Biden's idea, which was expressed yesterday in the Washington Post and has been expressed in hearings at other times, because he does believe, as I do, that ultimately the NATO alliance has a role to play in Iraq. One way of trying to accelerate that might be through a summit conference in which our President, our Secretaries of State and Defense showed great interest.

Clearly, we are showing great interest in trying to get the U.N. interlocutor back into Iraq to talk to the Iraqis to try to help formulate a plan for governance that might have international acceptance.

MR. BORGIDA:

Would you recommend, though, to President Bush, if he were to pick up the phone after hearing our discussion, and say, Mr. President, I think we need to extend the deadline, I think we need more troops on the ground, and I think we need to have you attend a summit with European leaders? Would that be an active recommendation?

SENATOR LUGAR:

Well, I'm not prepared really to give that recommendation that categorically to the President, because I take giving that kind of advice very seriously. On occasion, the President has actually asked me for advice, and I have given him my best judgment.

What I am saying is that I want to listen, as I think Senator Biden is eager to do, to a good number of people now, taking a look at this situation as of April the 5th and counting toward June 30th, of how prepared are we for the June 30 deadline, what should we be doing, if that is to be the deadline? What is our plan? And then we need, likewise, some recommendations from the President as to who an ambassador might be, how the 3,000 people who are supposedly going to be in the largest embassy ever formulated will be selected. What kinds of people? What constitutes that group? And who will provide security for them?

MR. BORGIDA:

Senator, I got the impression, in an interview that you did yesterday, and it sounds similar today in our discussion, that you are frustrated.

SENATOR LUGAR:

Well, I hope that I'm not frustrated. I'm inquiring. But I'm inquiring on behalf of a lot of people who I think share those same questions. And I am in a position to call hearings and to try to get answers. Now, we may or may not be successful.

I would just point out that prior to the United States military action in Iraq, our committee also called hearings. At that time, General Jay Garner had been proposed as a leader of a contingent of about 150 people meeting at the Pentagon to think through postwar planning. And we asked either General Garner or others of his folks to come over and clue us in as to what the plan was. Now, they never arrived. Even on the very day we were going to have the hearing with General Garner, he was briefing the press at the Pentagon but not briefing us. Of course, these days the press shares these messages back and forth, so we were getting the full benefit of General Garner.

MR. BORGIDA:

That sounds like frustration, Senator.

SENATOR LUGAR:

Having gotten the thing, we found that it wasn't very satisfying. And as a matter of fact, it was a near disaster, except for very, very limited things that the plan called for. But it missed the boat with regard to understanding Iraq.

Now, having gone down that trail, we all understand Iraq better. We need to understand it better still. I just want to make sure that there is at least somebody in our government who is doing this detailed planning and the contingencies that it entails.

MR. BORGIDA:

Well, you have made your concerns clear in media interviews, and I'm sure you will make them clear in the upcoming hearings. Senator Lugar, thanks for being our guest on NewsLine.

SENATOR LUGAR:

Thank you, sir.

(End of interview.)

NEB/KL