18 March 2004
State's Armitage Says U.S. Intent on Successful Transition in Iraq
Mar. 18 interview with Australian Broadcasting Corp.
The United States is intent on a successful political transition in Iraq, said Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage in a March 18 interview with the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
"[W]e have only one exit strategy and that exit strategy is success," Armitage said, stressing that the United States will remain engaged after handing over sovereignty to an interim Iraqi government on June 30. Success, he added, will not be defined by a "time certain or a date certain" but rather by "circumstances of security which permit a governing Iraqi body to be fully competently in charge of their country and for all the neighbors of Iraq to be fully confident that Iraq will never again be a threat to them."
Armitage rejected assertions that the timing of the handover was determined by U.S. domestic political considerations, pointing out that the transition date had been set in consultation with the Iraqi Governing Council. The short lead time, he said, has forced transition planners to concentrate on essentials.
"Most noteworthy...was the March 8th agreement on the transitional law, or the basic law, which takes the place of a constitution," he noted.
While acknowledging that the transition will not be easy, the deputy secretary said work was progressing. He suggested that elections might be held by the end of the year.
"[T]he Iraqi Governing Council has sent a letter to New York asking that the U.N. come back as soon as possible to help develop the elections and the electoral process," Armitage said. "So we think we're right on track with it."
Following is a State Department transcript of the deputy secretary's interview:
(begin transcript)
U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
Office of the Spokesman
March 18, 2004
INTERVIEW
Deputy Secretary Richard Armitage with Kerry O'Brien of the Australian Broadcasting Corporation
March 17, 2004
Washington, D.C.
MR. O'BRIEN: Richard Armitage, as we do this interview, they're still cleaning up after the latest Baghdad bomb blast with more than a score of deaths. Put simply, you have massive hurdles ahead on the road to democracy in Iraq, don't you? That is, if you can call it a road.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, good evening, Mr. O'Brien. Sure, there are massive hurdles. There are also massive hurdles which we've already jumped. We're in this for the long run and we'll get there.
MR. O'BRIEN: Reflecting on the past year and looking to the future, how do you respond to the proposition that not only was President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq based on a false premise, that Iraq had dangerous weapons of mass destruction, but you also have the nightmare of an exit policy that is fraught with difficulties, and in the eyes of many, lacking credibility?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Mr. O'Brien, as far as our President's concerned, he's got no second thoughts. He made a decision that he felt was in the best interest of our nation and many other nations also agreed and came along.
There were programs of weapons of mass destruction. We're disappointed we haven't found actual weapons. It's not over.
On the question of an exit, we have only one exit strategy and that exit strategy is success. And we're going to get there and we're going to stay till we get it done.
MR. O'BRIEN: Are you comfortable with the way America brought forward the date of its political handover to Iraq to June 30, and the strong perception that the deadline was dictated more by President Bush's need to reduce the weight of a potential political millstone around his neck leading into your own presidential election than by consideration for Iraq?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I think the way you put that, I'd have to respond with an eight-letter word, and the word, of course, would be nonsense. As I think I've expressed to you before, Mr. Bush was not the one who set the timetable. This was set together with the Iraqi Governing Council.
We know we have a fine line to walk between being an occupying force and a liberating force. And so we, working with the Iraqis, together settled on a date of 1 July for a turnover of sovereignty and we'll make it.
MR. O'BRIEN: By all reports, though, the State Department wanted a much longer lead time before handing sovereignty over to Iraq. Isn't that so?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: No, I think it is not so. If it had been so, I think Secretary Powell or Rich Armitage would have known it.
The fact of the matter is that we had as a government, generally originally settled on about an 18-month timetable, but in consultation with the Iraqi Governing Council, decided to shorten the timeframe until 1 July. And it actually has had one already very beneficial result and that has forced people to concentrate on doing the things that are necessary to develop sovereignty.
Most noteworthy of them was the March 8th agreement on the transitional law, or the basic law, which takes the place of a constitution.
MR. O'BRIEN: But it's just over three months away to that handover now and no one can agree on an election date even for an interim government in Iraq. They can't agree on how the vote should be conducted and the UN position is far from clear.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I think while you slept, others were working, sir. Mr. -- or the Iraqi Governing Council has sent a letter to New York asking that the UN come back as soon as possible to help develop the elections and the electoral process.
So we think we're right on track with it. Is it going to be easy? No, it's not going to be easy. Is it worthy work? You betcha.
MR. O'BRIEN: But you don't know any dates yet, do you? And you don't know how that election would be conducted.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: No, we are not quite sure how the election can be conducted and that will be part of the task of the UN: help organize that and to organize the Iraqis for it and to help get their minds around it.
But we do expect an election by the end of the year, roughly the end of the year, December or so.
MR. O'BRIEN: And do you have any idea how that election will be conducted?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: No, I say I'll wait till the UN team gets back out there. They'll be there shortly.
MR. O'BRIEN: So there are all these balls still in the air but the handover is set in stone at June 30. And you're saying that the issue of President Bush's reelection had nothing to do with the final setting of that timetable.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Oh, absolutely not. In fact, President Bush has said time and again, and Secretary Powell has said time and again, that we're seeing this thing through to the end. We're not going to cut and run and the only exit strategy is success. And that's not -- success is not based on a time certain or a date certain. It's based on the time or the circumstances of security which permit a governing Iraqi body to be fully competently in charge of their country and for all the neighbors of Iraq to be fully confident that Iraq will never again be a threat to them.
MR. O'BRIEN: In terms of the support that you're receiving from your allies in Iraq, you must be worried that the implication of Spain's threat, apparent determination to withdraw its troops from Iraq, at the spectacle, for that matter, of an ally like Spain describing the occupation of Iraq as a fiasco.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, we've had conversations with the -- with Mr. Zapatero. My own view is a little different from yours. I saw several million Spaniards holding their hands up the other day in the wake of the terrible Madrid bombing. And what I saw was not people holding their hands up in surrender, but holding their hands up against terrorism.
So I think in the longer run, terrorists have awakened what's going to turn out to be a very virulent enemy for them in Spain.
We'll see as we move forward. It's the Prime Minister's right to remove his troops. I noticed that he did say that he would remove the troops if there were not some sort of unspecified UN mandate. So I think we've got a while to go and we'll see how it plays out.
MR. O'BRIEN: When you look at the violence, the escalated violence in Iraq, the fact that, you know, that even as we speak, as I say, they're still cleaning up after the latest bombing. And looking at all of the elements, going into the difficulties of creating a democracy, how real is the prospect ahead of a civil war? How real is your fear of a civil war?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I've noticed that the violence that you correctly ascribe to Iraq has not been so much directed by Sunnis against Shia or Shia against Sunnis. It is directed thus far against Iraqis of any stripe who are working to develop the infrastructure, working to develop security services. It's also violence against foreigners, most recently today, Jordanians and Egyptians and others who were living in that hotel. The character of this violence has changed. And I think with that changed character, I think the insurgency is actually developing some real sort of blowback against them, in the Arab world and in Iraq. At least that's the way our fellows on the scene see it.
And I could give testimony to that by the fact that Iraqi police recruits have been targeted in very high numbers and yet, every day when we go down to the training areas and the stations of recruitment, we find even greater numbers of young men and women signing up to serve.
MR. O'BRIEN: How soon will America be ready to share with the world the results of its interrogations with Saddam Hussein, Tariq Aziz and others?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I'm not sure. Of course, some of the results of the Saddam Hussein interrogation will have to be shared at the time of a trial, which will be, of course, run by Iraqis.
Now, I've seen some of the results of these debriefs and we've got a lot of dots to connect, I think, before we throw these out publicly.
MR. O'BRIEN: I think you said recently, from what you'd read, he seemed to be having some fun.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I think what I said is he's turned out a pretty wily guy who seems to be enjoying the give and take with his interlocutors. He sure thinks he's smarter than everyone else, that's for sure.
MR. O'BRIEN: When do you expect to see Saddam front the Iraqi tribunal to answer for his crimes and are you at all nervous about that process somehow going off the rails in such an unstable environment?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: No, I'm not nervous about it going off the rails. And it will come forward when the Iraqis themselves pronounce themselves ready for this.
There's a good deal, I think, of interest in Iraq for seeing the tyrant finally brought to his knees.
MR. O'BRIEN: After September 11, America had overwhelming good will in the world and a very strong unified coalition in the fight against terrorism. The strength and unity of that coalition was shattered over Iraq. The UN was left deeply wounded. How do you begin -- and I know there is a dividend at the end of the line, if you are actually able to hold up a democracy at the end of this process, which might be five, ten years away.
How do you begin to calculate the negative price that America might ultimately have to pay for its decision to invade Iraq?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I don't know the, sort of the macro answer to your question. And I won't try to dissuade you, because I think you've correctly said that there is a lot of neuralgia about the United States' role in the world and I think sometimes leadership has to be willing to accept some of that neuralgia.
But with the UN, which you described as "wounded," we've had since then four separate resolutions on Iraq, which have been unanimous. We've also had other resolutions on Haiti and the like. So I think we're getting back to business in a more usual fashion in New York.
But some of those who most readily opposed us in going to Iraq -- for instance, our German friends -- Chancellor Schroeder just visited with President Bush and they both pronounced the past as over and are looking forward to a much better future together.
So time heals a lot of wounds. Some of our activities and the way we interact, both bilaterally and multilaterally will help tend those wounds and we'll get past it.
MR. O'BRIEN: In terms of how the war is being received in America, Mr. Armitage, you're a former Navy Seal. You don't think the American dead from Iraq deserve the powerful symbolism of being publicly honored and publicly mourned rather than being brought back to America under a media ban?
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: There certainly -- well, first of all, we believe that the families of these men and women who sacrifice should be accorded the first information and the respect of determining how they want to grieve.
In terms of mourning for the families, I don't think anyone mourns more deeply than our President, Secretary Powell, myself -- I was not a Navy Seal, I was a counterinsurgency officer, but it's not far from a Navy Seal.
MR. O'BRIEN: Richard Armitage, thank you very much for joining us.
DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Thank you, Mr. O'Brien.
(end transcript)
(Distributed by the Bureau of International Information Programs, U.S. Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)
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