Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD)

DATE=7-23-03

TYPE=INTERVIEW

NUMBER=3-740

TITLE=SADDAM HUSSEIN'S SONS

BYLINE=DAVID BORGIDA

DATELINE=WASHINGTON

INTRODUCTION

President Bush says the deaths of Saddam Hussein's sons are a clear sign that the former Iraqi regime is gone and will not be coming back. Now the Bush Administration says it is making good progress in efforts to rebuild the war-torn country. James Phillips from the Heritage Foundation talks about the events.

MR. BORGIDA

And now joining us, James Phillips, an expert on Iraq with the Heritage Foundation here in Washington. Mr. Phillips, thanks for joining us.

MR. PHILLIPS

Thank you.

MR. BORGIDA

You've been here before. A couple of questions to begin. These two brothers, there is some concern in the Arab world and perhaps in some quarters inside Iraq that this is all fictional, that they are in fact not dead. And there has been some discussion within the Defense Department that perhaps photos of the two ought to be released for this purpose, to edify the public. What's your thinking about that?

MR. PHILLIPS

Well, it makes me a little bit queasy, because I'm sure the bodies aren't going to be in the best of shape. But if that's what it takes to convince Iraqis, then the coalition forces may be forced to do that. But maybe they could find some other way, perhaps finding reputable Iraqis that could vouch for the fact that they're dead. But probably most Iraqis are going to want to see that themselves.

MR. BORGIDA

Yes, apparently some within the government did vouch for the ID. That was in our previous report. Is it important, do you think, for the Arab world and for Iraqis to have a sense of certainty about this in terms of how they view the days ahead with Saddam still out there?

MR. PHILLIPS

I think it would be a tremendous burden off the Iraqi people's shoulders if they knew for certain that these two were gone, because many Iraqis still are hedging their bets. They fear that the regime may return and they fear retribution if they cooperate with the coalition. So this I think would change the political dynamic inside Iraq.

MR. BORGIDA

The two sons, as we've described them in our previous report, are quite brutal. Is there any doubt in the Western world that these are the two men, who were unsavory characters, to put it lightly?

MR. PHILLIPS

I don't think there's any doubt in the Western world, and among most Iraqis there is probably no doubt. But unfortunately I think many people in the Middle East don't have the best information about what's going on in their region. They're often spoon fed information or misinformation by their governments, so they may have a different view of Saddam's regime.

MR. BORGIDA

Let's talk a little bit about the road ahead. Mr. Bremer has been in town, and there is a lot of focus on what to do in the weeks and months ahead. The council has been working for a couple of weeks now. How do you see the weeks and months ahead, particularly now that it appears that perhaps the intelligence on the ground for coalition troops is improving to the point where people will let them know where people are, as occurred in this case?

MR. PHILLIPS

I think there's a growing momentum within Iraq for the Iraqi people to pick up and rebuild their country, and I think this will help even more. The coalition forces are starting to talk about putting together an Iraqi army, Iraqi militias. The governing council itself I think is building support, and it's going to the U.N. So other countries are seeing that there are Iraqi leaders that are rising up in the postwar era. And I think on the whole it's a good trend.

MR. BORGIDA

Will the killing of the two brothers give more and more incentive for those out there who perhaps are so motivated but also, let's face it, motivated by the prospect of the $25 million reward, to let forces know where Saddam may be or at least give them their best intelligence at this point? Is the prospect of that better now?

MR. PHILLIPS

I think it's much better, because it's been shown that it can be done. And as more and more of the old regime is swept up, more Iraqis will be encouraged to take the chance to cooperate to turn them in. I think it's just a matter of time before Saddam Hussein himself is captured or killed.

MR. BORGIDA

Now, why do you say that, because he's been pretty successful at hiding so far?

MR. PHILLIPS

He has been successful, but they did capture his personal secretary in mid-June, and now his sons, and I suspect that he actually may be hiding somewhere within 20 to 25 miles of his sons, and it's becoming increasingly dangerous for him to move around. So the longer he stays in one place, the more at risk he is.

MR. BORGIDA

The U.N. is beginning some discussions on postwar Iraq and, as I mentioned, Mr. Bremer is in town, however briefly. The focus, in the last minute of our discussion, on postwar Iraq, do you think it's stability that's the most important thing, restoring some of the basic infrastructure? What would you say are the top one or two elements that need to happen in the weeks and months ahead for the Iraqis themselves to be able to grab a hold of their country and govern it?

MR. PHILLIPS

I think the number one priority has got to be security and also involving Iraqis in building that security. And for that reason I think the move to introduce an Iraqi militia that would defend the governing council and the government that eventually comes out of that, I think that's an important move.

Secondly, I think it's important to rebuild the infrastructure and the services, such as electricity, water, telephone communication, in order to bring things back to normal as quickly as possible. It is true that before the war Iraq was having trouble maintaining its infrastructure. Saddam preferred to spend money on palaces and stay in power rather than repairing what needed to be repaired. But over time I think the situation will gradually improve, and then eventually Iraqis increasingly will take ownership of Iraq's future. And then at that point the U.S. can turn it over to them.

MR. BORGIDA

We all hope that that does occur. James Phillips of the Heritage Foundation here in Washington, thanks for joining us today.

MR. PHILLIPS

Thank you.

(End of interview.)

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