21 December 1998
TRANSCRIPT: INDYK INTERVIEW ON CNN SPECIAL REPORT ON IRAQ
(Says damage to U.S. Mideast policy has been "very limited") (1780) Washington -- Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs Martin Indyk says damage to U.S. foreign policy in the Middle East as a result of the air strikes against Iraq has been "very limited." Speaking in an interview December 20 on a CNN Special Report on Iraq, Indyk also said the four-day military operation against Iraq succeeded in weakening Saddam. "I think (damage to U.S. foreign policy) is actually very limited. I have to say that I think that this operation was a great success in terms of making Saddam weakened, making the region safer, making the cage that he's kept in stronger," Indyk said. "We did it with very limited civilian casualties, as far as we can tell, and very limited international fall-out. In the Arab world, I think there was a general consensus that Saddam Hussein was to blame. We got criticism from, I think, only two out of 21 Arab nations. The Arab governments were all making clear that he was responsible. There were some isolated incidents and demonstrations, which is not surprising. But I think overall there was understanding that Saddam Hussein yet again brought this upon Iraq," he said. With regards to future steps towards Iraq and the status of the weapons inspection process, Indyk said the United States will "take the initiative" to work with the U.N. Security Council "to plot a way" to implement U.N. resolutions on Iraq. Towards that end, "the next phase is very much a diplomatic phase," Indyk said. "I think the French and even the Russians ... have made clear that Iraq does have to live up to its obligations under the Security Council resolutions. We're prepared for that. But the resolutions are there; they're clear in terms of Iraq's obligations. UNSCOM is the mechanism by which Iraq must be disarmed ... if Iraq is not disarmed, then the sanctions cannot be lifted, according to the resolutions," Indyk said. Asked about U.S. efforts to involve the Iraqi opposition in the Clinton administration's "new strategy" on Iraq, Indyk said U.S. officials "have been in touch with the Iraqi opposition for some time now, not just in the context of this crisis." The Secretary said U.S. officials have already worked to reconcile the two main Kurdish groups that operate in Northern Iraq, and also have stepped up contact with the Iraqi opposition based in London and elsewhere. "We're going to work with both the inside and the outside to try to effect this change in (Iraq's) government. It's going to take time and we're going to pursue two principles ... that change has to come from the Iraqi people ... and whatever we do, we're going to maintain the territorial integrity of Iraq...." Following is the State Department transcript of the interview: (Begin transcript) U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE Office of the Spokesman December 21, 1998 INTERVIEW OF ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE MARTIN INDYK ON CNN SPECIAL REPORT IRAQ December 20, 1998 Washington, D.C. QUESTION: (In progress) -- for the United States State Department. Welcome, Mr. Indyk, thank you for being with us. ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: Thank you, Tim. Q: We have been talking for the last 30, 40 minutes or so about the different pieces in this puzzle of a new policy. One of course is that the US forces will remain in place; another is that the sanctions will remain in place -- unclear whether UNSCOM will be allowed back into Iraq. But have you been talking, in another area, with some of the Iraqi opposition that could be poised to take some action, to become more involved in this new strategy, this new policy? ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: Well, we have been in touch with the Iraqi opposition for some time now, not just in the context of this crisis. In November when President Clinton made clear that we were going to work for a new government in Baghdad, we stepped up our contacts. We had already worked to reconcile the two main Kurdish organizations that operate in Northern Iraq, and we've been reaching out to Iraqi opposition in London and elsewhere to support their efforts to work towards a day that there's a new government in Baghdad that will live up to its international obligations, that we can work quickly with to lift the sanctions and bring Iraq back into its rightful place in the community of nations. Q: Will any of these groups really have any effect unless there is some kind of a military action mounted inside Iraq? ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: Well, I think it's correct to say that the change is going to have to come from within. It's not going to be done by remote control from London. The Iraqi opposition in London can play an important political role in holding up the truth of what Saddam Hussein's regime is like and working to indict Saddam Hussein as a war criminal and making clear that there is an opposition. There is resistance in Iraq at this very moment -- both in the south from the Shias and the north from the Kurds; the Sunis in the center have more difficulty because they're more subject to Saddam's direct suppression. We're going to have to work with both the inside and the outside to try to affect this change in government. It's going to take time and we're going to pursue two principles as we do that; which is, number one, that the change has to come from the Iraqi people themselves. We're not going to impose a leadership on them or a government on them. We're going to support them in their efforts. Number two, whatever we do, we're going to maintain the territorial integrity of Iraq as part of our policy, which has always been the case. Q: All right, Martin Indyk, I want to bring in CNN correspondent Brent Sadler from Baghdad. Brent, did you have a question? MR. SADLER: Yes, I did. Mr. Indyk, what makes you think and US policy believe that this time it could be any different? Let's go back to 1991 when there were armed revolts in both the north and the south of the country, and the people of Iraq were urged to rise up and try and overthrow President Saddam Hussein? We've seen him, very soon after the bombs stopped falling here, he sounds the same man as he has always been -- as defiant as ever. What makes you think that the opposition, US efforts to support the opposition are going to make any real difference this time? ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: Well, first of all, I want to make clear -- we're not calling on people to rise up now. What we're saying is this is a process; we're going to take it step by step. Hopefully we've learned some things over the past seven years. I think also the Iraqi people have learned something over the last seven years, which is that Saddam Hussein is never going to be able to bring them a better future. With him as the leader in Iraq, there's going to be a continuation of this situation because he's not prepared to comply with Iraq's international obligations. I think the Iraqi people are fed up. You in Baghdad probably can get a better sense of that. But I think that they deserve a better future; that they aspire for a better future. The question is whether there are ways that we can help them achieve that. That's going to be a process that's going to take time. As I said, we'll take it step by step. Q: Ambassador Indyk, as you look at the overall situation, we've seen the demonstrations from Damascus, in Jordan, elsewhere around the Middle East. How do you assess the collateral damage to US foreign policy as a result of all this? Is it going to be long term? ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: I think it's actually very limited. I have to say that I think that this operation was a great success in terms of making Saddam weakened, making the region safer, making the cage that he's kept in stronger. We did it with very limited civilian casualties, as far as we can tell, and very limited international fall-out. In the Arab world I think there was a general consensus that Saddam Hussein was to blame. We got criticism from, I think, only two out of 21 Arab nations. The Arab governments were all making clear that he was responsible. There were some isolated incidents and demonstrations, which is not surprising. But I think overall there was understanding that Saddam Hussein yet again brought this upon Iraq. Q: Brent Sadler in Baghdad, you had a question for Ambassador Indyk. MR. SADLER: Yes, Mr. Indyk, how do you assess the future in terms of diplomacy? Who's going to move that along? And do you think that the weapons inspection process -- the return of those inspectors -- is now out of the question, given Iraq's quite clear policy statements over the last 48 hours that they will not accept a continued regime of economic sanctions along with weapons inspections? But of course, let's remember that Iraq is obliged under Security Council resolutions to go on with those inspections. How do you see that developing? ASSISTANT SECRETARY INDYK: Well, I think you're absolutely right. We will be taking the initiative in the Council and in consultation with other members of the Council starting on Monday, tomorrow. The next phase is very much a diplomatic phase. I think the French and even the Russians in President Yeltsin's statement today have made clear that Iraq does have to live up to its obligations under the Security Council resolutions. I think the French and the Russians in particular will be keen to see the Council getting back into action. We're prepared for that. But the resolutions are there; they're clear in terms of Iraq's obligations. UNSCOM is the mechanism by which Iraq must be disarmed, and only UNSCOM can declare whether Iraq has been disarmed, according to the resolutions. If Iraq is not disarmed, then the sanctions cannot be lifted -- again, according to the resolutions. So we'll be working with the others in the Council to plot a way ahead for implementation of the resolutions. If Saddam Hussein does not cooperate and does not comply, well, the answer is clear: the sanctions will remain in effect. Q: US Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs, Martin Indyk; Mr. Ambassador, we thank you for helping us to understand the latest on US policy and a strategy that seems to be in the development stage. (End transcript)
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