04 January 2002
Transcript: Powell Seeks End To India-Pakistan Crisis
(BBC Interview January 4) (2040)
Speaking with the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC) on January 4,
Secretary of State Colin Powell said he hoped India and Pakistan could
avoid military confrontation and work together to fight against
terrorism, and not against each other. Powell also said he believed
India and Pakistan would eventually have to open a political dialogue
over Kashmir.
He commended Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf and Indian Prime
Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee for steps taken and statements made by
both to avoid military confrontation in retaliation for the terrorist
attack on the Indian parliament December 13.
Asked if the U.S. shouldn't be tackling the Kashmir issue, Secretary
Powell responded, "Kashmir is a difficult issue. It has been for many,
many years. And I think it's going to have to be part of a dialogue
between the two nations in due course. But right now we have to focus
on the dangerous situation that is before us, and that is the
mobilization of forces that are in close proximity to one another,
with the possibility of some sparks setting that off. And then we are
into a conflict between the two nations, two nuclear-armed nations".
In answer to a question about a possible special envoy to India and
Pakistan, Powell said that appointment of a special envoy to the
region was "under consideration."
Powell said the U.S. would try to be helpful, and would encourage the
two countries to talk to one another. The Bush Administration, he
said, has been in daily contact with Pakistani and Indian leaders
since the December 13 terrorist attack on the Indian Parliament.
While the situation remains very dangerous, Powell noted "It is in
everyone's interest to try to solve this through diplomatic and
political means, and there have been some encouraging signs in recent
days, and we are going to build on the progress that I think we have
seen."
The transcript of Secretary Powell's full interview follows.
(begin transcript)
U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE Office of the Spokesman January 4, 2002
INTERVIEW OF SECRETARY OF STATE COLIN L. POWELL BY BBC
Washington, D.C. 11:35 a.m. EST
QUESTION: Mr. Secretary, I know you have been closely watching the
India-Pakistan situation. Do you believe that Pakistan has done enough
now to reign in the militant or terrorist groups operating from its
soil?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, I think Pakistan has done a great deal since
this crisis started on the 13th of December, first by arresting the
leaders of the two terrorist organizations most closely linked to
being the perpetrators of this act, the JEM and the LET. Pakistan has
also arrested a number of other individuals who might be associated
with terrorist activities. So they have done quite a bit.
But beyond just arresting people, I think President Musharraf has made
a number of bold statements with respect to moderation and going after
extremist elements within Pakistani society. And it just didn't start
since the 13th of December; he has indicated since the beginning of
the campaign against terrorism that he would be moving in this
direction.
So he has done quite a bit, and I expect him to do more. I expect him
to make other statements when he gets back from the SAARC meeting in
Katmandu, and in due course we will see whether or not we have found a
political and diplomatic solution to this crisis.
I am also encouraged that on the Indian side, even though they have
mobilized their forces, and even though I know how shocked they were
by this horrible attack against their democracy, a strike against the
Parliament of India, where the terrorists came in to try to destroy
the leadership of this democratic nation, and they have mobilized in
response to that, I also take note that the Prime Minister of India is
anxious to find a political and diplomatic solution, as he has said
almost every day in the past week.
QUESTION: Was Pakistan supporting terror before this?
SECRETARY POWELL: I think the question is terrorist organizations in
general. Both of these nations have suffered from terrorist attacks
against them; we all have. And what we are trying to do now is to
channel the anger that exists, channel whatever effort there now
exists -- and there is considerable effort -- into a campaign against
all forms of terrorism, wherever it exists around the country, or
around the world -- not here in the United States, but around the
world -- in India, in Pakistan, and go after terrorist organizations
that are trying to go against democratic nations, going against
nations that are trying to move forward into the 21st century.
And so we are encouraging all nations to do that. We are encouraging
India and Pakistan to work within this coalition to fight against
terrorism, and not fight against each other.
QUESTION: Well, you, the United States, are open to charges of
hypocrisy. You have asserted the right to go into Afghanistan to root
out the terror that attacked you; why can't India not do that now?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, India is mobilizing because they are concerned
about what happened, and deeply concerned, and they felt a need to
mobilize. What we are saying to the Indians, and to the Pakistanis, is
that there are other ways to solve this problem. And one way that we
are all working toward now is to get the Pakistani Government to take
action against these terrorist organizations, and President Musharraf
is doing so. Is there more he can do? Yes, I'm sure there is, and I
expect him to do more.
Every day for the past week or so, he has taken a step or more in that
direction, and I think we should take note of that. The Indian
Government has taken note of it. And I think both the Indian
Government and the Pakistani Government realize that it is not in
anyone's interest for a war to break out in South Asia. It is in
everyone's interest to try to solve this through diplomatic and
political means, and there have been some encouraging signs in recent
days, and we are going to build on the progress that I think we have
seen.
Prime Minister Blair is in the region now, and I'm sure he will have
constructive discussions with both sides in this vein.
QUESTION: Is this the moment for the leaders of the two countries to
meet at the summit they are both attending?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, they are both there. They are both in the same
room. The rules for SAARC, as I understand them, is that you do not
talk about bilateral issues; you talk about economic issues affecting
the whole region. But perhaps there will be an opportunity for the two
leaders to have a word about this, and I hope if that opportunity
presents itself, they will take it.
But that's up to them. They are leaders of two sovereign nations, and
they will make their own judgment as to whether it is appropriate for
them to talk in Katmandu or not. But you can be sure that the rest of
us -- the British Government, the United States Government, the
Russian Government, the United Nations -- all of us have an interest
in what is happening in South Asia; all of us have an interest in
bringing this dangerous situation to an end; and we all have a common
goal of doing it through political and diplomatic means, and not
resorting to war.
QUESTION: You are dealing with the symptoms here; why not really
tackle the cause, which surely is Kashmir? Is it not time for a really
deep initiative on the political situation there?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, Kashmir is a difficult issue. It has been for
many, many years. And I think it's going to have to be part of a
dialogue between the two nations in due course. But right now we have
to focus on the dangerous situation that is before us, and that is the
mobilization of forces that are in close proximity to one another,
with the possibility of some sparks setting that off. And then we are
into a conflict between the two nations, two nuclear-armed nations.
And so we have to use all of our political and diplomatic efforts now
to solve this immediate short-term problem, and then deal with the
long-term issues that exist between the two nations.
QUESTION: Well, will you push them into that dialogue in due course?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, it's not a matter of pushing them. They are
nations that are well aware of their respective interests. We will try
to be helpful. We will encourage them to talk to one another. And to
the extent that outside nations can assist and the United States can
assist in encouraging such a dialogue, we will do so.
QUESTION: There has been talk of your sending an envoy, or the
President sending an envoy. Is that under discussion?
SECRETARY POWELL: Well, we have two excellent envoys there now,
Ambassador Blackwell in India and Ambassador Chamberlain in Islamabad.
Both of them have done a superb job. They are in constant daily,
almost hourly, contact with their Pakistani and Indian counterparts.
To some extent, I have been an envoy by phone, speaking to the leaders
on a regular basis, and the President has also been in touch. As far
as somebody actually going there to add to our efforts, this is under
consideration, and we will take a hard look at this at the beginning
of next week, after the leaders have returned from Katmandu. They are
all in Katmandu right now, so there wouldn't be much point in sending
an envoy right now, or for additional presence. We are being well
represented by Ambassadors Chamberlain and Blackwell.
QUESTION: What about the nuclear issue? If the worst comes to the
worst, have you any kind of assurances from the two governments that
they wouldn't let a war go to that terrible strait of going nuclear?
SECRETARY POWELL: Prime Minister Vajpayee said yesterday, in
clarification of remarks he had made a day earlier, that India would
not resort to first use of nuclear weapons. The Pakistani does not
have such a declaratory policy, but I think both nations recognize
that this is not something we want to even give consideration to. We
have got to make sure that we don't start down this road. And that's
why we are anxious to see the situation stabilized, and then start
moving in the other direction.
Both nations are mobilizing. We hope that those mobilization efforts
can come to a halt quickly, and not go any further toward actual
clashing of forces, and that we can start finding ways to de-escalate,
both militarily and diplomatically and politically. And there are some
encouraging signs out there, but I don't want to overplay this. This
is still a very dangerous situation.
QUESTION: Well, how confident are you that this can be resolved
peacefully? And how important is it to the United States?
SECRETARY POWELL: I think it is important not just to the United
States; it's important to India and Pakistan to find a diplomatic
solution. It's important to our international campaign against
terrorism to have had almost four months now of considerable success
in that part of the world, with our campaign against al-Qaida and bin
Laden in Afghanistan, to suddenly find that the situation gets out of
control because of this crisis between India and Pakistan. It is
important for all of us to find a political and diplomatic solution.
It is the interest of the United States, the United Kingdom, the
international community at large, and of course, I think it is in the
interest of Pakistan and India.
Both of the leaders -- both President Musharraf and Prime Minister
Vajpayee -- had said, have both said they are looking for a political
and diplomatic solution. And so far that quest continues, and there
has been some success. But we are far away from a solution, but we are
trying to reach that solution.
QUESTION: Mr. Secretary, thank you very much for your time.
SECRETARY POWELL: You're quite welcome. Thank you, sir.
11:43 a.m. EST
(end transcript)
(Distributed by the Office of International Information Programs, U.S.
Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)
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