Press Briefing, Feb. 11, 2007
Multi-National Force-Iraq
Sunday, 11 February 2007
Maj. Gen. James E. Simmons, Deputy Commanding General for Support, Multi-National Force - Iraq
IRAQ OPERATIONAL UPDATE BRIEFING BRIEFERS: MAJOR GENERAL JAMES E. SIMMONS, USA, DEPUTY COMMANDING GENERAL FOR SUPPORT, MULTINATIONAL FORCE-IRAQ; LOCATION: COMBINED PRESS INFORMATION CENTER, BAGHDAD, IRAQ TIME: 3:15 P.M. EST DATE: SUNDAY, FEBRUARY 11, 2007
Good afternoon, I’m major general Jim Simmons, the deputy commanding general for support for Multi-National Corps Iraq. I am responsible for the day to day employment of the Corps separate commands and brigades to include the 36th Combat Aviation Brigade, and I’m also responsible for several focus areas as directed by Lieutenant general Odierno.
One of those is aviation. I’m a master Army aviator. I’ve been flying Army aircraft for almost 31 years. I’m rated in five different aircraft types. I command an Apache squadron and an Apache brigade. I spent two years as the director of Army Safety and the commanding general of the Army Safety Center.
We take every engagement of our fixed and rotary wing aircraft seriously. When an aircraft is reported to have been shot down, we bring a specially trained team to determine what weapon system actually inflicted the damage that resulted in the loss and the tactics the enemy forces employed. Some of those investigations take time.
Since December of 2004, we have averaged about one hundred aircraft engagements per month. The overwhelming majority of those engagements are from small arms and automatic weapons fire. On average, about seventeen aircraft are hit per month. Because of the skills of our aircrews, and the outstanding machines that they fly, most of these result in aircraft returning to base for minor repairs.
Since the 20th of January, we have had an increase in aircraft that have been shot down. We have had two UH60 aircraft that were shot down. EZ four zero that resulted in twelve KIAs and Tarantula two six that resulted in zero casualties. That aircraft was secured and recovered and has been returned to service. We also had two AH64s that were also shot down. Big Gun seven two in which there were two KIAs and Crazy Horse zero eight in which there were two casualties killed in action. There were also two civilian helicopters that went down during this period.
I have no personal knowledge of those events. It has been reported that one of those resulted in casualties and that the other event resulted in no casualties. We have had a report and coverage of a Marine H46 that went down with seven casualties this past week. The report that has been rendered to the Corps headquarters is that it is believed this was a mechanical malfunction. There is no indications that we have seen that the enemy is employing any form of advanced ground to air missile. Now with that as a backdrop, I am prepared to answer your questions.
Q.(off mike missed words) The question is, we pray for mothers that there is no indication they have any weaponry on the ground. Do you see any indications that the insurgents, whoever they are, shooting at the aircraft are using new tactics, doing a better job of figuring out flight patterns, adapting the way that we see guerillas adapt around the world to the patterns that the Coalition aircraft are using in the sky to further their goals of shooting down these birds?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS We are engaged with a thinking enemy. This enemy understands based on the reporting and everything else that we are in the process of executing the Prime Minister’s new plan for the security of Baghdad. And they understand the strategic implications of shooting down an aircraft. And therefore, it is in their interests from a strategic perspective to attempt to engage and shoot down our aircraft. In two of the incidents in which we had shoot downs, EZ four zero and Crazy Horse zero eight, we know that there were multiple weapons systems that were involved in the engagement. This is not a new tactic. It was used against the 4th Infantry Division during their deployment here south of Baghdad. But it is the first time that we have seen it employed in several months.
Q. You say that you don’t see any evidence that advanced missile systems are being used here, but we are looking at some type of a missile being used here? Or is it heavy caliber machine guns? Or exactly what it is that’s hitting…
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I will break it down into the four aircraft that were shot down. I’ll take Tarantula two six first. I was with that group whenever that aircraft went down, so I’ve got firsthand knowledge on that one, so I can report that that one was brought down by automatic weapons fire. The pilots that were flying the aircraft very skillfully landed that aircraft in Multinational forces area south of Hit. Once they were on the ground and safe, we came in and picked them up and the Marine Corps came in and provided coverage and then we launched a QRF out. We recovered the aircraft and took it to Al Asad, and repaired it and it is back in home station. EZ four zero, the one that started this on the 20th of January, we know that that aircraft was hit with heavy machine gun fire. We know that because EZ five three, the flight that was one minute behind this flight, once they saw the aircraft go in and the lead aircraft had come back around and the two door gunners had dismounted the aircraft in order to try to recover people out of the aircraft – EZ five three and his wingman put themselves in between where the enemy had engaged the aircraft, and in fact killed four of the enemy who had engaged the aircraft from the back of a truck, and then later we had a man pads bird from the 1st of the 82nd that came in and took out another gunning placement in the location. So we know that this was multiple machine gun fire. On Big Gun seven two that was involved in the fight in Najaf -- this aircraft was hit with machine gun fire. It was hit with other weapons systems. It is under analysis. EZ four zero is still under analysis as well. We will do all the forensics to determine exactly what weapons systems were involved. Crazy Horse zero eight, I have nothing that I can tell you about that one. That was the last AH64 that went down. That is still under investigation and we are looking at all of the evidence on that one. I hope that answered your question.
Q. Just to clarify, the last one that you mentioned, Crazy Horse zero eight, was that the transport helicopter that you were investigating …
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: No ma’am that was the second Apache that went down.
Q. And is there a fifth that you are investigating mechanical failure for?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: The H46 that went down, that belongs to the Marine Corps. It had just seven casualties on it. The report from the Marine Corps to date is that they believe that was as mechanical failure based on the reports of the wingman.
Q. Are there changes in tactics that Coalition helicopters can or are doing now to avoid this?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Sir, every time our aviators break friction with the ground and go out to accomplish their mission, they look at a number of things. They look at the weather. They look at the terrain they are going to fly over. They look at the vegetation they are going to fly over. They look at the enemy situation. And they base their tactics, techniques and procedures that they are going to employ during that mission based on that update that they receive before they leave the ground. We have many different tactics that we employ over here, and it really depends on which part of the country you are in as to which tactics you employ. I’m not going to get into the specifics of what we do. I just left out of a meeting. The second one that I’ve had since this started with all of the aviation senior commanders in theater, and we are looking at all of our options about how we go about approaching this situation on a mission by mission basis.
Q. Can you just straighten us out on some of the dates on the other ones – Big Gun seven two, Crazy Horse and the CH 46. And also Al Jazeera is now reporting that another helicopter is down, and I wonder if you’ve heard anything.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: No ma’am I have not. EZ four zero went down on the 20th of January. Tarantula two six on the 25th of January – Big Gun seven two on the 28th of January and Crazy Horse zero eight on 2 February. I don’t know the exact date, but the four six that went down is the most recent one.
Q. There were reports from those involved in the incident when the Blackhawk went down on January 30th of an insurgent body recovery team that was about a click away from their guys who were firing that the choppers. Our understanding is that body recovery team was also taking out [inaudible] reports. Can you confirm that please and tell us what that says about the tactics that their using? And also I understand that the report from the Marine Corps is based on the fact that the wingman didn’t see any ground fire, but what basis is there for their making a determination that it was mechanical failure? And if the investigation is still ongoing, if it is, what is the evidence that is saying it is mechanical failure.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: From what I understand, the reports from the Marine Corps said that it was that it was mechanical. Yes, there is an investigation ongoing and they will determine conclusively whether it was mechanical or if it in fact it was engaged. We have no reports that it was engaged. As far as the EZ four zero, I am not familiar with the report that you are talking about. There were multiple engagements that we made in that process in taking down the forces that were employed against the aircraft. We had two Blackhawk’s, EZ five three that came in and with their door gunners engaged while we had AH64s from the 25th Infantry Division that were responding to the area. Those two UH60s kept the enemy penned down until the Apaches got there, and then the Apaches picked up the engagement.
Q. Just to clarify, so the Marine Corps (inaudible) is not definitive that it was mechanical failure. The investigation is still ongoing.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: They are continuing to investigate, but the reports that we have is that it was mechanical.
Q. On what basis?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS Of the observations of the wingman that was flying with him.
Q. (inaudible words) How is that a definitive …
MAJ GEN SIMMONS. Because of the manner in which the aircraft was flying as they were trying to put the aircraft on the ground.
Q. Can you describe it? Because we have seen video that has been released.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Yes, what I would tell you is that from the descriptions of his wingman, the video does not tie in very well as to the descriptions of his wingman of what the aircraft was doing during the process of them going to the ground.
Q. So you think it’s not video of the H46?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Personally speaking, I do not. Yes, sir?
Q. Sir, in terms of the (inaudible) reemergence of this tactical and enmeshing fires and multiple teams that you haven’t seen in some months since the 4th ID was deployed. We know that in a public (inaudible) the Al Qaeda organization threw down the public gauntlet and said that it’s so called air defense battalions are targeting your aircraft. Do you have any reason to believe… who is trying to shoot down these aircraft… you linked it to the Baghdad Security Plan, the reemergence of this tactic. Do you know who is shooting down your birds?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I would say that we are continuing to develop information that we have about who is shooting down the aircraft. I think that the statement that I made about the strategic implications of them shooting down the aircraft. This is a knowledgeable thinking enemy that we are up against. There is certainly a possibility that there is a linkage between two of the shootdowns based upon the tactics that that were employed. But we have not established any clear linkage or any established cell or formation that we could say was an air defense formation that is doing this.
Q. It’s certainly, primarily, in Sunni areas, except from the Najaf incident, which was of its own nature. We’re mainly talking about known Sunni insurgent areas of operation, be it Al Qaeda. You’ve got to have something … what’s your gut, what’s your general indicator showing you?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS The areas in which EZ four zero, Crazy Horse zero eight and Tarantula two six were all shot down in areas that are traditional Sunni areas. Yes.
Q. You can’t make any judgment based on that? You can’t say, we’re thinking it is Al Qaeda. We’re thinking its Sunni insurgents?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I’m not in a position to answer that. Yes sir?
Q. Which were the two that were linked.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: EZ four zero and Crazy Horse zero eight.
Q. Why do you think they are linked?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Because they emplaced IEDs along the most likely avenue of approach that the ground QRF would respond to?
Q. And did they have any effect? The IEDs?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: It took us a long time to get there ... by ground… it did not take us long to get there by air.
Q. There were reports of QRF casualties and the evacuation of one of the civilian helicopters. Can you confirm exactly if there were casualties and what the nature of those were?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I have no reports of any casualties that we had in response to the civilian helicopter that went down, I believe, south of Baghdad. Yes sir?
Q. Your comment about not having identified an air defense, but hearing this sort of thing about how they had strung IEDs along one of the routes. So do you think, this is a basic question, there are guys, insurgents, out there whose jobs it is to shoot down helicopters and they plan how it is and wait for it? Or do you think they are doing other things and helicopters pass.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: The majority of the engagements, which I told you are about one hundred a month, the majority of the engagements are from small arms because we happened upon them doing something else. And they are either returning fire because we are in the process of engaging them, or they are engaging from a self protection perspective. .. Behind you. Yes sir?
Q. Can you address the sophistication of these sort of attacks. The people who are doing this? Would you classify this as a lucky hit? Or is there specifically targeting the helicopters, they have experience doing this, training doing it, possible from outside of Iraq? How would you classify it?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I have no indication that there is training from outside of Iraq. I would tell you that someone who is involved in a fight, who is adaptive and thinking, will develop the tactics to be able to engage people. I believe that is what we have seen here. The Tarantula two six flight. I think we just happened to upon some guys who were involved in perhaps putting some weapons in a cache or taking some weapons out of a cache, and we stumbled upon them and they engaged us with what they had and they got lucky and hit the second aircraft. On the flight that was down in Najaf, that was a battalion level engagement. There was a lot of gun fire being exchanged. This was a wingman that was protecting the lead as lead went in to engage the enemy and he got hit and went down. There was an awful lot of gunfire going down at that time, whenever that aircraft went down. But similar to the EZ four zero engagement was the Apache that went down Crazy Horse zero eight which appears to have some of the similar tactics. It’s not all that far away from where EZ four zero went down. And that is the one we’re concentrating on as to whether there was some kind of information sharing. Whether it was at least part of the group, we know we killed four of them for certain. And we don’t know how many were involved in the EZ four zero engagement.
Q. Could you address the point of how much this is due to the increased use of aircraft in general in theater now that the roads have been so dangerous for the past couple of years that they need so many aircraft, the use of them has exponentially increased. Is that part of this too?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: In 2005, we flew about 240,000 hours on Army aircraft here. This year, we will fly over 400,000 hours, so there is certainly increased usage of aviation rotary wing assets here in theater, and with that there is more exposure for the enemy to have more opportunities to engage the aircraft.
Q. And for 2007?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Right now for 2007, we are on track to execute over 400,000 hours on Army rotary wing aircraft.
Q. What would you attribute the rise in flying hours to over the period?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Part of it has to do with moving of people and supplies. In many cases it’s more efficient, it’s more effective, to move people and supplies by air than it is by ground. It’s also here as of recent been safer.
Q I’m sorry general. I’m confused on the numbers … 2005, it was 240,000 hours and this year you’re on track for 400,000… what about last year?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: 334,000.
Q. Could you just tell me how many aircraft, helicopters, rotaries have been lost since 2003? Since the beginning of this?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Since 2003, we have lost 29 aircraft.
Q. Could you break that down?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: How would you like that broken down?
Q. Service?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS Those are U.S. Army helicopters.
Q. (inaudible)
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Those 29 aircraft I’m talking about were engaged by the enemy.
Q. What about Marine? Does that include Marine?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: No, that number right there has to do only with U.S. Army aircraft
Q. Those are helicopters?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: Those are all helicopters. That starts 23 March 03 through 02 February 07.
Q. Did you learn anything about who it was that was engaging at the EZ four zero scene where you killed the group with machine guns?
Q. Would you be very specific about what you mean by small arms fire to include SO7s, or just machine gun…
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: No, I’m talking about primarily machine gun fire 7.62, 12.7 and once we get up to 14.5, we consider that heavy machine gun fire. We also leave it at heavy machine gun fire up to 23 millimeter.
Q. When you talk about other weapons systems, you’re talking about surface to air missiles?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS Yes, they have employed surface to air missiles here in the past. SA7s, SA14s and SA16s.
Q. To great effect?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: They have had effect on us in the past, yes.
Q. To what degree general? Have they downed aircraft. Are they seen as an increased level of threat?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: They have downed aircraft here in the past with shoulder-fired air defense weapons systems.
Q. Can you break down the 29?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I can, but I won’t.
Q. Is there something the Marines have in relation to the 29?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I do not have the Marine Corps data. I will be honest with you. I wasn’t planning on doing this today.
Q. I’m flying today. How do you characterize a normal flight activity?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I fly with these guys about five or six days a week. As a master Army aviator myself, I can’t tell you how proud I am of the young men and women who are operating these machines. They are incredibly talented. They are incredibly bright. They are incredibly courageous. But they’re also – it’s a matter of routine. They are very professional about what they do, and they get up in the morning knowing that they are going to be rendering a valuable service to all of us who are here. And they get about doing their job. And they do it very well. We will continue to fly. It is the safest way I know of to get around here in Iraq. And we will continue to do it, and I will be proud to fly with them.
Q. We can hear in Baghdad the air traffic is not what it is normally, and having flown with the military the last few weeks the air traffic doesn’t appear to be as crowded as it normally is. Can you tell us what, if any impact, this has had?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: We have not cancelled one mission, and there has been absolutely no reduction in rotary wing aircraft flight, nor will there be.
Q. I know that you guys are always mixing it up in regards to how you fly, with take-offs and landings and the like. I understand there is a step down where it doesn’t’ actually mean you’re reducing the number of flights, but it means you’re taking extra time for security and for maintenance for choppers and the like.
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: We have not down that at all.
Q. Well that was out of our Pentagon folks, and D.C. is always wrong. But I am curious, to what level are you considering doing things differently and how much more differently can you do them. I know there is always …
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: There is many different ways you can go about doing things. I will tell you as I mentioned earlier, I have had two meetings with the battalion and brigade commanders about these issues. We had scheduled and we executed today a monthly aviation conference, in which the O6 level, the colonel level commanders, meet with me and we talk about standardization issues, safety issues, maintenance issues, air space issues and we talk about tactics, techniques and procedures. We talked about these issues today. But we have not stood down the fleet. We have, each formation, has looked at what they’re doing, but we have not reduced the amount of flying that we have been doing. We have reviewed our procedures. And we have made modifications to how and when and where we’re flying. And we will do that periodically.
Q. On that 29, can I ask how many people have been killed and how many have been wounded?
MAJ GEN SIMMONS: I think I have that information here somewhere, but I don’t have it on me. James Hutton can get that information for me. That’s a matter of public records.
I appreciate the opportunity to sit down and talk with you.
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