Military

DATE=06/20/03

TYPE=INTERVIEW

TITLE=RERUGEES: SADAKO OGATA/WORLD REFUGEE DAY

NUMBER=3-708

BYLINE=AMY BICKERS

DATELINE=TOKYO

CONTENT=

VOICED AT:

INTRO: Sadako Ogata, who was the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees from 1990 to 2000, spent World Refugee Day (Friday) in Tokyo, attending a conference on refugees in Africa. V-O-A's Amy Bickers sat down with Ms. Ogata to discuss the plight of refugees across the globe, and what can be done to improve their security and protect their human rights.

AB: How do you characterize, right now, the global refugee situation?

SO: The number of refugees is not an insignificant one. The people who the U-N-H-C-R is responsible for must be something like 20-million. And I think its a proof of what humanity has to take care of. Most of them are in that situation for reasons of insecurity, or violations of human rights, reasons beyond what they can manage.

AB: Can you elaborate on who becomes a refugee?

SO: Anybody can become a refugee . all of a sudden . suddenly a coup d'Etat takes place in their country, and they have to flee, or a government changes, and there's repression, so they have to flee, or conflict between communities, where they thought they were living together opens up suddenly. . So, anybody can become a refugee. That's a reality, and in that sense, even in very powerful countries, things can happen.

AB: Is the world doing enough for refugees?

SO: Well its never sufficient . because the refugee protection, the refugee assistance work requires a great deal of compassion. At the same time, the system is there. The question is, how much do you live up to the system? And by the system, I mean, it's two-fold: One is for those who are seeking asylum ... -- at least to take the proper steps, to examine how good are their cases; and if they merit protection, then you take legal measures. But then, the other one are when there are large scale refugee outflows. Then you can often not examine them individually. But the host country -- and you cannot even chose your neighbors, something happens in your neighboring country, and people flee -- well then, the international community has to come in and help this country to at least alleviate the suffering under emergency situations.

AB: What now are the hotspots for refugees? Where should we be watching around the world?

SO: I hate to say where, because I don't want to promote those possibilities, but I think they are here and there in Africa. Congo . within Congo, which is a huge country, as large as Western Europe, a lot of people are fleeing inside, but they can flee outside the country, which then affects all the neighboring countries, as well. There are still several countries, whether Somalia or Sudan, where refugees are fleeing across borders. I would say the southern Caucuses have to be watched, because you have a lot of unsolved political problems. . And what would happen in the Middle-East . depending on the political developments.

AB: What about China and the North Korean population there? The people who have fled North Korea, either because they are hungry, or for political reasons.

SO: I think the rest of the world is noting. China is a signatory party to the refugee convention, which means they have legal obligations to examine the claims of those who seek asylum in China. I think, on the whole, China says the people who are fleeing are not really refugees, but are migrant workers. That has been their claim, and I think from a refugee protection agency point of view, they have to be examined.

AB: What would you like to see governments do to help alleviate this problem?

SO: What a refugee agency like U-N-H-C-R tries to make sure, that those who need asylum are at least given the chance to survive. There is the security coverage. With security, comes the need for daily food and medical care that must be provided. But the other thing I would like to see is a solution to the problem, the source of the problems that make people flee. So, if there is government within a country where there is fighting, political insecurity and so on, I think intervene in a way that the causes of the refugee flight are contained quickly. (SIGNED)

NEB/HK/AB/BFS-T/JO/TW