04 October 2002
Department of Defense Briefing Transcript
(Philippines/U.S. casualty, terrorism/campaign, Iraqi WMD/threat,
Afghanistan/weapons cache, alert status/Philippines, Blix
meets/Powell/Rice/Wolfowitz, Philippines attack/Abu Sayyaf, Israeli
response/Iraqi attack, al-Qaeda/Iraqi connection, Boeing/General
Dynamics, V-22/status, southern Iraq/leafleting, Commando Solo/Iraq,
Indo-Pakistani/missile tests, Iraqi deception/denial, Iraqi
opposition/payments) (4660)
Assistant Secretary of Defense for Public Affairs Victoria Clarke and
Rear Admiral David Gove conducted the Defense Department briefing
October 4.
Following is the Defense Department transcript:
(begin transcript)
United States Department of Defense
Presenter: Victoria Clarke, ASD PA
Friday, Oct. 4, 2002
(Also participating was Rear Adm. David Gove, deputy director for
global operations, J-3, Joint Staff.)
Clarke: Look! We have a new person.
I have just a couple of notes, and then -- introduce my new partner
here.
First, on behalf of the Department of Defense and the American people,
we would like to extend our deepest sympathy to the family, friends
and colleagues of Sergeant First Class Mark W. Jackson, Special Forces
soldier and 19-year Army veteran who was killed Wednesday while
supporting U.S. efforts in the Philippines. And we extend our
condolences as well to the families of the Filipino soldiers who died
in the same attack. Sergeant Jackson is one of 52 American service
members who have lost their lives in the global war on terrorism since
roughly this time last year. Their deaths remind us of the sacrifices
these people -- these dedicated men and women -- make every day to
defend freedom around the world. They also strengthen our resolve to
eradicate terrorism and the threat it presents to our nation and to
the world.
And clearly, there is a lot of focus right now, as there should be, on
the very real and growing threat that Iraq poses. And there's much
scrutiny, as there should be, of that regime's tactics. We believe it
is very important to provide you with as much information as possible
so the people can judge for themselves the nature of the regime, what
we're dealing with as we go forward and help them make the tough
decisions. And that's why recently, we had a senior Defense official
here, talking about programs -- weapons of mass destruction programs,
including the Iraqi regime's. That is why the secretary and the
chairman went to some great lengths to talk about the no-fly-zone
violations -- no-fly zones that were set up to protect the Iraqi
people from the Saddam Hussein regime and the repeated attacks on U.S.
and coalition aircraft.
In the next few days we hope to provide you with some more information
on the Iraqi regime's denial-and-deception operations -- operations
that are very organized, that are very comprehensive and clearly
intended to hide Iraq's weapons of mass destruction. I think it's very
important to remember, as the secretary said last week, that this is a
regime that consistently lies. They lie to their own people, and they
lie to the world. And people should consider that fact very, very
carefully as they weigh their decisions on how to deal with Iraq.
Looking ahead to next week, Monday does mark the one-year anniversary
of the start of military operations in the global war on terrorism.
And we will be giving you an update then of the accomplishments so
far, as well as some highlights of the accomplishments that we need to
address going forward.
And finally, General Rosa has a big smile on his face this morning
because he is not here. So I can introduce Rear Admiral David Gove,
who is taking over for General Rosa. Admiral Give is deputy director
for Global Operations on the Joint Staff. He is a submariner who has
served aboard both ballistic missile and attack submarines. From '91
to '94 he commanded the USS Louisville and more recently the Submarine
Development Squadron 12 in Groton, Connecticut. There he was
responsible for operations command of seven attack submarines and
overall submarine force tactical development and analysis of real-
world operations. Welcome aboard.
Give: Good morning, and thank you, Ms. Clarke.
On behalf of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, I would also
like to offer our thoughts and prayers to the families and loved ones
of Sergeant First Class Mark Jackson, who was killed on Wednesday.
An Army Special Forces captain was also wounded in the explosion. He
underwent immediate surgery at Camp Navarro on the Philippines and is
currently in intensive care at a U.S. military hospital in Okinawa.
Our best wishes for a complete recovery.
Our prayers also go out to all our Philippine friends who were killed
or injured in this explosion, and to their families.
A military team has arrived to assist in the investigation.
In Afghanistan yesterday, U.S. forces destroyed a weapons cache near
Kandahar. The cache was the largest amount of weapons destroyed to
date and included nearly 420 500-pound bombs. The munitions were found
several weeks ago buried underground.
The 3rd Battalion of the Afghan National Army graduated from Kabul
Military Academy yesterday. U.S. forces trained this 3rd Battalion.
The 4th Battalion started their 10-week training on September 15th,
and the French are training the 4th Battalion.
And with that, we'll take your questions.
Clarke: Charlie?
Q: Torie, is the DEFCON status -- what is the DEFCON status in the
Philippines, especially the southern Philippines? And has it changed
since the explosion? And have U.S. soldiers been told to stay away
from public areas, such as markets?
Clarke: Well, we try hard not to talk about DEFCON status. They
change. They go up and down. A great deal of leeway is given, if you
will, to the local commanders to decide what they think is
appropriate. And I am absolutely confident the commander is taking any
appropriate measures.
Q: Have U.S. troops -- (inaudible) -- been told to stay away from
public areas, such as markets?
Clarke: I'm not aware of it.
Give: I'm not aware of it. The Pacific Command has responsibility for
the force protection changes and making sure that the troops are
taking all necessary precautions.
Q: And Admiral, your statement about these -- the 420, 500-pound bombs
-- these are aerial bombs that were found buried?
Give: I don't know if they were aerial bombs --
Clarke: (To staff.) Yes. Did they say yes?
Q: Well, what would the Taliban and al Qaeda be doing with 500-pound
aerial bombs?
Give: I'll have to take that question and get back to you with the
answer on that.
Q: Torie?
Clarke: Yes, sir?
Q: Good morning.
Good morning, Admiral.
Give: Good morning.
Q: Can you tell me, will the secretary meet with Hans Blix today? If
not, why not?
Clarke: Secretary Powell, and I believe the national security adviser,
Condi Rice, are going to meet with him, and Deputy Secretary Wolfowitz
will meet with him. With the conversations, the discussions at the
United Nations, clearly it's the Department of State taking the lead
on that.
Q: And the secretary is not going to take part, just the deputy,
right?
Clarke: Not scheduled to.
Q: Very good.
Clarke: Tammy?
Q: On the Philippines, is there any actual evidence yet that Abu
Sayyaf was behind the attack that killed the troop?
Clarke: The investigation is underway. And as the admiral said, we
will be participating, helping in that. There have been some
indications from the Filipinos that they believe that is the case. But
it's still under investigation.
Q: So no clear evidence yet, it's simply an indication?
Clarke: Correct.
Jim?
Q: Apparently Amos Yaron, the head of the Israeli Defense Ministry,
had a meeting here earlier this week with Douglas Feith. I was just
wondering whether it was conveyed to him that the United States would
not like Israel to get involved if there were a conflict with Iraq,
and whether it received any assurances to that effect from the
Israelis?
Clarke: I don't know about the meeting. We can take that and see if we
can give you some feedback on that. But the secretary, from up here,
has said it would be overwhelmingly not in Israel's interest to get
involved.
Q: Has he received any assurances from the Israelis in this meeting or
in other forums, that they would not?
Clarke: I'm not aware of the conversations. I said we'll see what we
can get you from the Doug Feith meeting, if anything. But again, those
sorts of conversations -- one, you're talking about hypotheticals a
little bit. But those sorts of conversations, discussions, the
Department of State's going to have the lead.
Q: Admiral, can you provide a little more detail on this cache of
weapons that was found, sort of exactly where, how it was found? And
you said largest cache of weapons to date. It was all in one place?
And any more detail you can provide.
Give: It was the largest one to date. It was found several days ago
buried underground near Kandahar. And the specifics about more detail
in terms of what exactly was there besides that cache, I'll have to
get back to you.
Clarke: But it is -- as we said before, it is an example of how much
work we have yet to do. We continue to find caches of weapons and
ammunition. Clearly, the al Qaeda, the Taliban had a great deal of
intent -- some still have intent -- to do harm.
Q: When you say large, is it by tonnage, by numbers, by what?
Give: I mean by numbers of large weapons. And we'll provide specific
detail about what the Central Command discovered and destroyed.
Clarke: And also find out if it's the largest amount found or if it's
the largest amount destroyed, because often when we find this stuff,
some of it we destroy, some of it gets turned over and used for the
Afghan National Army.
Q: But it was -- in one place this was the largest destroyed, so it
was all found in one place?
Give: That's my understanding.
Clarke: We can get some more on that. Sure.
George?
Q: There's been a lot of talk about al Qaeda and Iraq connections.
Does the U.S. have evidence of government -- Iraqi government
involvement with al Qaeda in terroristic activities?
Clarke: The furthest -- repeat the last part of your question.
Q: Does the U.S. have evidence of Iraqi government involvement with al
Qaeda involving terroristic activities?
Clarke: To separate from al Qaeda for a minute, clearly Iraq has been
and continues to be a state sponsor of terrorists and terrorist
organizations. On al Qaeda, the furthest I can and will go is say we
know al Qaeda has been in Iraq. We know senior al Qaeda have been in
Iraq. As the secretary said, it is very hard to believe that in a
country with such an oppressive regime, in which very little goes on
that they are not aware, it is hard to believe that they are not aware
of what might be going on. But that's the furthest I can go on that.
Tony?
Q: I have a non-Iraq, non-Afghan question. Last week the Pentagon
notified Boeing and General Dynamics that they would begin collection
efforts on the famous A-12 case starting Monday if payment wasn't
made. Payment wasn't made. Collection hasn't started. What's the state
of play there?
Clarke: Lots of conversations going on with the companies. The date
was September 30th. They've not received payment. But the discussions
are under way with the companies. The people in the building who are
involved are hopeful that those discussions can actually produce some
constructive efforts going forward.
There are -- part of the discussions are the size of the payments and
the timing and those sorts of things. So I know there are castes of
many people here working hard on that one.
Q: Is it fair to say, though, that the Pentagon is moving toward a --
pulling the trigger and starting collection; or holding out hope that
they don't have to do that?
Clarke: It's not fair or unfair. What's accurate is to say that
September 30th was the deadline, that they are actively talking with
the companies, trying to move this forward.
Q: Move it forward, though, in terms of figuring out how much to
collect?
Clarke: It's figuring out the timing and the structure of the
payments.
Q: But it seems to me that the decision's been made to go forward with
the collection of -- now -- you're the -- the (small grasser?) or in
terms of how it's being done.
Clarke: I wouldn't -- I wouldn't tilt it either way, Tony. The
September 30th was a deadline, wasn't made, so they are in active
conversations with the companies.
Q: Okay.
Q: Torie, speaking of aviation, can you give us an update on the V-22
program? How's the flight testing going? How's it look, as far as
going into at least limited production? Has there been a change of
heart by anybody about the program?
Clarke: Gosh, I guess it depends on what your -- where your heart was.
There are lots of --
Q: Well, you know it should be -- (inaudible) -- to it. We're now told
that. Maybe you swing around the other way, based on the flight
testing.
Clarke: You know -- really can't give you any guidance on where things
might end up. There are many, many programs -- a couple of dozen
programs currently under review. And I think later this fall, you'll
begin to get some indications of where these head.
I am absolutely confident that major weapons-systems decisions will
have a lot of input and a lot of attention paid to them from the
highest levels around here. I think the president himself has made it
clear that he cares deeply about how some of these decisions get made.
And -- cannot talk about where they might go; we can't even give hints
of where these things might go, for the obvious reasons.
But you can say this: If you're looking for guidance, if you're
looking for context of how they'll decide what to do with these, look
at the defense strategy. Look at what the defense strategy calls for.
Look at the context -- the world in which we find ourselves. And what
you're looking for is weapons systems that are faster, that are more
agile, that are more adaptive, that are more lethal, that focus less
on from where the threats might come and more on the kinds of threats
we might face. Look for weapons systems that, if you're a combatant
commander, you're not thinking one of the services, you're thinking,
"This is the job I need to get done. What's going to help me get that
job done?" So look at things to go through a very joint filter, if you
will. Then you get some indications of the factors that are being
weighed as they decide what to do with the V-22 and all the others.
Charlie?
Q: Are the leaflet drops continuing in the southern no-fly zone today?
And have they been extended to the northern zone? And do these drops
involve at all Commando Solo, with perhaps broadcasts?
Give: Yeah, leaflet drops are an ongoing program in support of
Operation Southern Watch. Two occurred last year, and on occasion, we
make the drops in order to further our strategy in Operation Southern
Watch. I'm not aware of any drops being made in Operation Northern
Watch. And --
Clarke: Not aware of Commander (sic) Solo, either.
Q: These are being dropped by what kind of plane?
Give: It was an A-10.
Q: Two occurred last year. Can you tell us about those and what was
dropped?
Give: We can get you copies of the leaflets. They were routine drops.
And typically, it's a message saying stand down from your
anti-aircraft fire and -- otherwise, you could be killed or injured.
And it's just trying to convince the folks that are manning the sites
that that's the wrong thing to do, to fire on coalition aircraft.
Q: Admiral, was there any indication last year, when the leaflets were
dropped, of any decrease in firing activity by the Iraqis after the
leaflets were dropped?
Give: The firing activity that we've seen over the last three years,
and so far this year, is relatively consistent. On average, it's about
the same.
Q: So you didn't see any drop-off after you dropped the leaflets?
Give: Not that I'm aware of.
Clarke: Jim?
Q: Can we expect to see more of these leaflet drops in the coming
days? I mean, is this -- in other words, is this part of a longer
campaign, or is this just an isolated event?
Give: This is in support of Operation Southern Watch, which is an
ongoing operation. And as far as, you know, future operations, I'm not
going to get into that. But it's possible that the decision will be
made to make future drops, but I'm not sure of the periodicity.
Clarke: And stretching it out a little bit, going forward, very
clearly, the secretary has stood up here and said as much. We want to
send a very clear message to the Iraqi people this is not about them.
You know, this is not about the Iraqi people at all. Send a very clear
message to those people, who for 10 years have been firing on our
pilots, and coalition pilots, trying to bring those planes down, is a
very bad thing to do and there are going to be consequences. So we're
going to find lots of ways to deliver those sorts of messages going
forward.
Q: Could you tell us how widespread the drops were yesterday? How many
sites? There were an awful lot of leaflets dropped.
Give: There were 120,000 leaflets dropped. And I don't know what the
geographic separation was. The mechanism is to go out in a package and
then burst over a wider area for better coverage.
Q: Was it just one A-10 or two or --
Give: They were A-10 aircraft. I'm not sure the number of aircraft.
Q: Torie, maybe you can talk about this. What's the idea of these
drops? What do you expect these people to do? What do you expect Iraqi
army people to do -- not follow orders? And what's the psychological
impact here?
Clarke: I'm not a leaflet expert, but I think it's pretty
straightforward. And you can see from the message on this: Do not fire
on these aircraft, do not fire on these -- not this many words, but
don't fire on these aircraft that are patrolling these no-fly zones to
protect people from Saddam Hussein's regime. That's a pretty
extraordinary backdrop for this.
Number two, do not fire on these aircraft. There will be consequences.
Other people who have fired on these aircraft have suffered
consequences. I think it's just a very direct and very clear message.
Q: It sends a clear message, but rather a difficult one for someone in
the Iraqi army to follow. That's, I guess, my question. What do you
expect? How do you expect this to work?
Clarke: Well, if you go back to the Persian Gulf War -- and I don't
see -- one of the fellows who used to be in here sometimes talked
about when Iraqi soldiers surrendered to him during the Persian Gulf
War. I mean, people have proven they don't have to do what they're
being told. Secretary Rumsfeld stood up here and talked about the
leadership in the Iraqi regime and the Iraqi military, saying, you
know, think about it. If you think about executing orders that Saddam
Hussein might give -- for instance, using weapons of mass destruction
-- think twice, because you'll be considered part of the Iraqi regime.
Q: So this is more in the future, because there's nobody to surrender
to now, so --
Clarke: Correct. We're all talking hypotheticals and all that.
Q: So -- I mean, so would it be fair to characterize it as the start
of a psychological campaign to undermine the morale of the Iraqi
military?
Clarke: This particular leaflet -- I think you're getting too far down
the road. This particular leaflet is designed for a very
straightforward effect: quit firing on our aircraft.
Q: Was there a specific trigger? I mean, the last one happened in last
October, I believe. Was there a trigger that caused this leaflet drop?
Clarke: I don't of a specific trigger, but the commander makes a
decision: what's the best use of our various tools and tactics at what
time.
Q: Did it work last year?
Clarke: I don't know. Somebody asked that question. I don't know what
the impact was last time Matt asked it.
Give: The numbers of firings and -- have been relatively consistent
from year to year.
Q: (Off mike) -- decline after the drop? (Off mike.)
Give: I don't have visibility on statistical analysis that was done on
the firings.
Q: Can you go back and check for us?
Give: We can check.
Q: Great. Thanks.
Clarke: Mm-hm. Matt?
Q: Torie, on another topic, is the Defense Department concerned about
the missile tests today by Pakistan and India?
Clarke: Don't have anything for you on that.
Let's go -- Tim, let's go behind you and then come back.
Q: There's a report on Al-Jazeera Television that Ayman Al- Zawahiri
is dead. Are you familiar with that report? Is that anything you can
comment on?
Clarke: I -- no, I'm not aware of it on Al-Jazeera. I heard another
rumor yesterday. But we don't have anything on.
Q: It's strictly a rumor at this point? Nothing to --
Clarke: You can call it whatever you want. I had not heard about the
Al-Jazeera report. I had heard about another one yesterday, I believe,
on -- Tass or somebody was sending one around. But I'm not aware of
anything.
Tony?
Q: The firings themselves -- can you characterize whether there's been
any trend toward more guided missile or guided ack-ack firing? Or has
it been continual kind of unguided "golden BB" shots in the air,
aimlessly, visual, without radar guidance? Is it more sophisticated,
is what I'm asking.
Give: It's been relatively consistent. Mostly unguided and
anti-aircraft artillery, AAA.
Q: So the leaflets weren't dropped in some effort to stem a more
sophisticated use of their ack-ak and radar guidance?
Give: Not that I'm aware of. This is part of an overall program to
make sure that the folks on the ground understand what their risk is
and how the coalition views their attacks on our aircraft.
Clarke: Pam.
Q: You said you're going to tell us over the next couple of days about
Iraqi denial and --
Clarke: We hope to.
Q: -- deception operations? How will that happen?
Clarke: Well, hopefully, we can do a briefing on it and related
topics. It is a very organized, very comprehensive effort that
involves a lot of people in the Iraqi regime, involves inputs and
guidance from the highest levels. Very, very sophisticated programs to
cover up weapons of mass destruction.
Q: It's all looking like the theme that sort of keeps coming up here
is this orchestrated campaign to somehow influence public policy.
Clarke: Secretary Rumsfeld will send me down a note about Pam Hess's
use of the word "orchestration." Just let the record show. (Laughs.)
Q: At any rate, maybe you can address the question. Is this, in fact,
an orchestrated campaign to somehow address or influence public policy
in a particular way? It all seems to be coming at a very critical
time, when Congress is taking up the matter, the U.N. is beginning
inspections.
Clarke: I'm tempted to repeat something the secretary said about
people ascribe an awful lot (of/to ?) strategy. But --
(Cross-talk.)
Clarke: It just seems like --
Q: -- Monday giving us a briefing.
Clarke: It just seems like a very obvious, important thing to do.
Clearly we, the country, the United Nations, Congress, are dealing
with incredibly serious issues right now, trying to figure out what do
we do with the Iraqi regime that has blatantly violated U.N.
resolution after U.N. resolution after U.N. resolution, which has
tortured and oppressed its own people, which has threatened and
invaded its neighbors, which has a very active and very dangerous
program of weapons of mass destruction.
People ought to be spending a lot of time thinking about it and
wrestling with those issues. And part of the thinking, part of the
consideration has got to be the fact that lies and deception and
deceit on the part of this regime are a very active and effective part
of their offensive, if you will.
So I just think it makes common sense to make sure people focus on
those sorts of things and weigh those sorts of things as they're
making these tough decisions, as they're weighing these issues.
Q: Torie, is this going to be the theme, though, that inspections are
going to be impossible to carry out because they have such an
aggressive denial and deception program? I mean -- is that the theme
we're going to be hearing, though?
Clarke: You guys are better at themes and titles and headlines than we
are. I'll just repeat what I've said, which is it is very, very
important for people to weigh the fact that there has been this
pattern and this practice for so long. So there is a very, very high
threshold to overcome in terms of credibility.
Q: And inspection -- and the effectiveness of inspections, I would
think, is it --
Clarke: One would include that in the mix.
Yes, George?
Q: Can you give us an update on where the negotiations are on payments
to Iraqi opposition groups like the INC, getting that -- keeping that
going?
Clarke: Very little. And I'll be honest with you, I've been pushing
for more information on that. You know, it's an interagency effort
which involves a lot of parts and pieces. And so I know what is under
consideration right now by the interagency team, including our folks,
is figuring out where do we go next and what kind of training,
logistics, et cetera. So, George, we can take that one and try to get
you more information.
Q: To go back to the issue of denial and deception, while we're
waiting for the briefing, could you perhaps tell us -- Admiral, as
well --
Clarke: You've got --
Q: -- whether there's evidence already that Iraq is making efforts to
conceal its WMD programs in anticipation of the return of inspectors?
Clarke: Yes.
Q: Can you elaborate?
Clarke: No.
Q: Why not?
Clarke: Because. (Laughter.)
Q: Because why?
Q: Well, if it's obviously important on Monday, why isn't it obviously
important to do it today and answer that kind of question?
Clarke: Because there are people with far greater skills than mine and
far greater level of detail of past practices and patterns of behavior
and the kinds of things they do with a certain amount of specificity.
So I very much want to leave that up to the experts.
In terms of what is actually going on now, you start to get into
classified information. It is for people at a far higher pay grade
than mine to decide if and when they put that sort of information out.
Yes, sir?
Q: Admiral, I wonder if you could tell us, if we start bombing -- this
is -- I guess could be a hypothetical question. I'm not asking about
specific plans --
Clarke: It's hugely hypothetical.
Q: But if we go after Iraq's weapons of mass destruction facilities,
the facilities that house the chemical and the biological agents, and
so forth, is there any concern that attacks on these facilities could
result in accidental release of these agents?
Gove: I'm not going to get into future operations that may or may not
occur and speculate about what might happen if such an attack were to
happen.
Clarke: Thanks, folks. Have a good weekend.
(end transcript)
(Distributed by the Office of International Information Programs, U.S.
Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)
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