27 February 2002
Transcript: Defense Department Briefing, February 27, 2002
(Georgia/U.S. Special Forces, Georgia/regional stability,
Georgia/terrorism, Georgia/al-Qaeda, al-Qaeda/Chechen rebels,
terrorism/unconventional war, Gerogia/helicopters, bin Laden/DNA)
(4260)
Pentagon Spokesman Victoria Clarke and Marine Corps General Peter
Pace, vice chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff briefed.
Following is the Pentagon transcript:
(begin transcript)
U.S. Department of Defense
Presenter: Victoria Clarke, ASD PA
Wednesday, Feb. 27, 2002 - 10:16 a.m. EST
DoD News Briefing - ASD PA Clarke and Gen. Pace
(Also participating were Assistant Secretary of Defense for
International Security Policy J.D. Crouch and Gen. Peter Pace, vice
chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff.)
Clarke: I hope people have told you, both the general and I do need to
scoot in about 20, 25 minutes. So we'll just address the big issue up
front.
And I will just say this about Georgia. As the secretary has said many
times, including on his trip to Georgia just a couple months ago, in
December, we greatly appreciate Georgia's participation in the global
war on terrorism. We value our military-to-military relationship with
them, which clearly predates September 11th. And we have always been
and remain committed to their efforts to improve their internal
security.
And with that, I will turn it over to the general.
Pace: Well, the operations in Afghanistan continue to focus in on
going after remaining al Qaeda and Taliban leaders.
In Georgia, if I could add, there has been a transfer of unarmed Huey
helicopters to assist that government with mobility for their own
forces, for their own security. Those helicopters have been delivered.
And there is a DOD team of seven people -- one U.S. military, seven
contractors -- who are assisting the Georgian government in receiving
the helicopters and going through the kinds of maintenance procedures
that you need to do to keep them flying. And European -- the U.S.
European Command is also working with their counterparts in Georgia to
determine what makes sense in the way of future planning and equipping
and training, to be presented to both governments for approval, to
assist, again, the Georgian government internal to their own country
with their own security problems.
And with that, we'll start the questions.
Clarke: Charlie?
Q: General and Torie, in these plans, do you in fact plan or hope to
send a number of trainers, Special Forces trainers to Georgia to help
them train their forces? How many might be sent? And how do you
respond to charges from Russian Foreign Minister Ivanov today that any
movement of U.S. troops to Georgia would only exacerbate tensions in
the Transcaucasus?
Pace: I'll take the first one. I'll ask Ms. Clarke to take the second,
if I could. The first part, we are still very much in the formative
stages, in the assessment stage, in the planning between the U.S.
European Command military folks and their counterparts in Georgia.
Once they've fleshed out a plan and have it ready for proposal to both
of our governments, they will do that. So the number of trainers and
the duration, those kinds of things are all part of what would
eventually come forward, but right now it's very much in the formative
stages and, again, needs to be submitted to both governments for
approval.
Q: But trainers are part of the plan, or the anticipated --
Pace: Well, we've asked the European Command to take a look and see,
with their counterparts, whether or not there's benefit to training
and equipping.
So if there were a plan that came forward that both governments were
comfortable with, then certainly trainers would be part of that. But
we don't know that yet.
Q: But the seven -- there are only -- you mentioned seven people in
Georgia right now. Are those the only American representatives in
military --?
Pace: No, I don't think so. There are probably some others on the
ground that is part of the normal military team that works with the
U.S. embassy. But the seven I was talking about was specifically there
for the transfer of the 10 Hueys.
Clarke: And let me -- the second half of Charlie's question. Charlie,
you know we are working closely and having discussions all the time
with countries around the world on the global war on terrorism,
including Russia. And we are working closely with Georgia because
internal security and stability there improves stability in the
region, and that is a good thing.
Q: General, what is it --
Q: Well, wouldn't -- excuse me. It would seem that Russia would be
pleased to have Georgia's military be more effective in a region where
Russia, in fact, claims that Georgia is harboring Chechen terrorists.
Clarke: Well, I can't speak for the Russians. I can just tell you what
we're doing, which is working very, very closely with a variety of
leaders around the world in the global war on terrorism, and we will
continue to do that.
Q: General, what specifically do you see as the concern in the Pankisi
Gorge area? And do you believe that al Qaeda is taking weapons there?
And if you can just elaborate on what that situation --
Pace: As you know, we are tracking terrorist organizations worldwide.
I believe the secretary said there's al Qaeda representation in at
least 60 countries that we know of. So I would not focus in on one
particular area as a particular concern. We're trying; as best we can,
to find the linkages worldwide and work with friendly governments
worldwide to assist them in their own internal security problems.
Q: But why Georgia?
Pace: Georgia right now is very much -- the two things I've told you
about. One is the helicopters, and two is working with that government
to see if there is training and equipping that we can do with them
that will assist them to become more proficient inside their own
borders with their own security forces to take care of their own
problems.
Q: Right. But what's your terrorism concern there? Why are you
concerned about it in terms of the war on terrorism?
Pace: I did not say I was concerned.
Clarke: We are concerned that the al Qaeda alone has cells in 50 or 60
countries around the world.
Q: But now wait a minute, wait a minute --
Q: If there's no concern about terrorism in this region, what is the
concern, then?
Pace: I answered the gentleman's question about what my concern was,
because I didn't say -- because I didn't say I had a concern.
Q: I mean, you talked about the helicopters. There's no concern about
--
Pace: No, no, we are --
Q: -- terrorism in that particular region?
Pace: Please. We are concerned about terrorism worldwide, and we spend
an enormous amount of energy trying to track the linkages with al
Qaeda and the other terrorist networks worldwide.
I cannot get into specifics of what we know about terrorist networks
in specific countries. That would be inappropriate for me to do from
this stand. Clearly anywhere there are terrorists in the world, we are
concerned. But I cannot quantify that for you from this platform.
Q: Do you believe it's possible that members of al Qaeda have gone to
the region? And is there any link between Chechnya and al Qaeda?
Pace: It is possible, and that is possible.
Q: Well, then wait a minute.
Q: Could you elaborate on that --
Q: That's a great soundbite.
Pace: I cannot.
Q: Until recently, Shevardnadze denied that there were any Chechens on
his soil, and as I understood it, U.S. officials believed
approximately the same thing. What has changed your mind? How recently
has your mind been changed? I mean is there anything you can give us?
I mean, you make it sound like Georgia's just another country, like
England. But you happen to be sending helicopters there.
Clarke: I'll try two things. One, we have had a military- to-military
relationship and ongoing activities with Georgia well before September
11th. Secondly, we have, as we said, been focused very hard on the
fact that al Qaeda has cells in 50 or 60 different countries around
the world. There have been some indications of connections -- some
connections of al Qaeda in that country. But going beyond that saying
there have been some connections is not appropriate.
Q: You just said there were some connections, didn't you? I mean -- I
don't mean to confuse --
Clarke: That's what I'm saying. We -- it's not appropriate for us to
go into any great detail about what we know. But we have said
repeatedly, it is important to go after the terrorists wherever they
are. Al Qaeda alone has cells in 50 or 60 countries around the world.
And there have been -- where there is information on some connections.
Beyond that, we're just not prepared to go.
Q: But Torie, when we were in Moscow, Shevardnadze publicly said that
he'd been worried about terrorists, and said they wanted help from the
United States, including training. I mean, you're refusing to even go
that far. Why?
Clarke: No, I think that's what we're standing up here telling you
about -- is we've been working closely with them for some time,
including prior to September 11th, so they can achieve better internal
stability and security, if you will. They have been very, very
supportive in the global war on terrorism, and we want to work with
them. But going into the details and specifics of what that
relationship might involve just isn't appropriate for us to be doing
right now.
Q: Could I go back for one second on General Pace? You were saying
that you are going to be talking with Georgia about the value of
whether you would be sending further trainers into the country. But
Georgia today is saying that they are offended by those military
advisers who are already there. If Georgia is having that response,
then it makes it sound like -- that you're basically saying you may
not necessarily send further trainers into that country.
Pace: No, I'm not at all aware of what you just referenced. So let me
just tell you that we are working government to government, and
through the U.S. military's U.S European Command, working with their
counterparts in Georgia to come forward with a proposal that would
make sense to both of our governments to move forward. It has not been
approved. It is simply an assessment that is ongoing to see where
Georgia thinks they may need assistance, and for us to see where we
think we may want to help. I'm not at all aware of what you just
mentioned, though.
Q: But say if Georgia decides we don't want any further people here,
then it's quite possible you may not send further trainers there?
Pace: I would think that if this is a train-and-equip program to be
approved by both governments, that if one government doesn't want to
receive or one government doesn't want to send, that this would not
happen.
Clarke: Let's go over here.
Q: Can we have something from the policy shop? I see Crouch over
there.
Clarke: What would you like to ask him?
Q: Well, I mean, could we ask him a question about it?
Clarke: Sure.
Q: Maybe policy, if it would be all right.
Clarke: Absolutely.
Crouch: Lucky me! (Laughter.)
Pace: We'll make room.
Q: I mean, could you do anything more to elaborate on the problem of
terrorism in Georgia and that region and the worry about al Qaeda?
Crouch: Well, I think it's -- you know, I guess I would say that we
have felt, as the last administration felt, that it was very important
that we maintain the sovereignty, territorial integrity of a number of
the countries in the former Soviet Union. Georgia is one of them. We
have developed a very close relationship with them, which, as Torie
and the General said, predates 9/11. In fact, I believe the decision
anyway to send those helicopters predates 9/11.
And so that was really -- that whole set of decisions was based, I
think more on wanting to establish a close military-to-military
relationship there, which we are doing. This is part of that program.
And I think it also -- if the governments make decisions to go forward
with the train-and-equip program, I think it will also have some
benefits in the global war on terrorism, but I think it's something we
support generally in terms of enhancing our military-to-military
contacts with the Georgians.
Q: In a nutshell, are you worried about spillover from Chechnya, rebel
extremists in Chechnya into Georgia? Is that part of all of this?
Crouch: Again, I think I would say what they said. I think it's really
inappropriate for us to comment specifically on specific problems.
The idea -- you know, we recognize that al Qaeda cells are in a large
number of countries. There are other places that are, you know,
cooperating with them. These are -- there are various networks out
there, as the secretary said, and we are tracking those networks. We
are going to work with countries to try to shut down those networks.
But I think it's really inappropriate for me to get into the
specifics.
Q: Well, could anyone --
Clarke: But nice try! (Off mike.)
Q: Could any one of the three of you say if there is any credible
evidence tying al Qaeda to Chechen rebels, or is that some of the
specifics that you're not going to talk about from this podium?
Clarke: Correct.
Q: Okay.
Clarke: Yeah. (Laughs.)
Q: Second, is this going to be structured much like the Philippines,
as far as the training and not getting involved in actually going
after --
Clarke: I'll make one general comment, and then General Pace can talk
more or less about specifics. But as we've said all along, it is such
an unconventional war, and we'll do different things in different
parts of the world, depending on the circumstances. So if we can
disabuse you of one thing that is of trying to tie these things up
neatly and saying, "Oh, well, this is just like this." It's --
situations are different, circumstances are different. So that's just
a context point.
Pace: And that's a perfect --
Q: Does it at least open the possibility U.S. troops might go in there
shooting?
Q: No, in other words, that's what his question was. Would they be
involved in combat -- (off mike) --
Q: I mean, that's what he's saying. Would these people mainly be
trainers, or would they be involved in active --
Q: Combat.
Q: -- combat?
Pace: That is really a very hypothetical question. The fact is that
the two governments are discussing right now ways that the United
States and the government of Georgia can work together to assist in
training, equipping the Georgian armed forces to help them with their
own internal security problems. That's what this discussion's all
about right now with them.
The helicopters, having been a separate issue decided earlier, were
provisions of helicopters, unarmed, that was agreed to by the two
governments months ago, to assist Georgia at that time with what they
had, which was a mobility problem. So we just take these things case
by case. Case one was helicopters. Case solved. Case two: What kind of
assistance now might we provide to them that would assist them in
growing their own armed forces to be able to do the capabilities that
they want their own armed forces to provide inside their own country?
That's what the assessment is about right now.
Clarke: Mm-hmm. I'm sorry. Let's go to Alex and then back here.
Q: Can you say how many helicopters have been sent and when did they
actually arrive in Georgia? And then, secondly, can you tell us
whether, since 9-11, aside from Georgia and the Philippines, there
have been any similar equipment transfers or training transfers to any
other countries that could be related to the war on terrorism?
Pace: I can come close on some of that. The helicopters that were
transferred were 10 from us. The exact arrival date, I do not know,
but I do know they're there.
Clarke: I think it was November -- mid-October.
Pace: (Inaudible) -- November. Okay. And I happened to do some
research on the other part. We work worldwide with our partners,
usually led by the U.S. ambassador in the country, working with the
U.S. military representatives on his or her team, working with the
host nations to determine what kind of military assistance they might
need. So transferring this kind of equipment or selling this kind of
equipment is really part of the day-to-day routine of what we do
worldwide.
Q: Say, for example, Yemen: Have you done any transactions with Yemen
in recent months?
Pace: No.
Clarke: Chris.
Q: General, in many countries in that area, we've had small JCET
programs -- your partnership for peace or whatever. Has Georgia ever
had a small-unit kind of thing like that? And would this basically be
an expansion of that?
Pace: I don't recall, but since we've been working closely with
Georgia since 1996, I -- I'll get you the answer on whether or not we
have -- (inaudible) -- JCET. But it would seem reasonable that we have
had small teams go in and assist with NCO training, leadership
training -- those kinds of things. We can get you the specifics on
that. Okay? [Since 1999, we have had three (3) Joint Combined Exchange
Training missions in Georgia.]
Clarke: We can take that one.
Q: What would the difference be -- the thing you're contemplating now?
How would that be different?
Pace: I'm not contemplating anything, so I can't tell you the
difference. But we're waiting for the assessment teams that have been
working together and the two governments to have a proposal provided
to us so we can take a look at it. And when we get that, we'll be able
to give you the details. But right now, I do not have the details on
that.
Clarke: Nick.
Q: What kind of discussions has the U.S. had with the Russians about
this possibility of putting U.S. trainers into Georgia? Have they
raised the same kind of objections that the foreign minister raised
publicly today? And if so, is the U.S. simply inclined to ignore those
objections?
Clarke: We have discussions with Russia all the time about a variety
of topics --
Q: What about this particular topic?
Clarke: -- including the global war on terrorism, including our
efforts in the region. And we'll continue to have those discussions.
But it's not appropriate for me to stand here and tell you every
sentence in every one of those conversations. But we have discussions
with them, and we're working closely with them, as well.
Q: But did Ivanov's public objections today come as any surprise to
anybody in the administration?
Clarke: I actually haven't seen them, so I just -- I can't talk to
them. I'm sorry.
Q: Torie, can we go back a moment? It almost seems like you're trying
to distance yourself from this being anything to do with the fight
against terrorism. Mr. Crouch said it would be a side benefit if it
also fought against terrorism.
Q: Could you define exactly what it is and what the link to fighting
terrorism worldwide is by possibly sending people to train and equip
in Georgia?
Clarke: I think what we're trying to do, and maybe we're not doing it
too well, is to bring some context to it. In context, to do that it's
important to look pre-September 11th and look at the kinds of things
we were doing, at the kinds of work we were doing with Georgia to try
to improve our relationship with them, to try to help them improve
their internal stability and security, because that's beneficial for
the region and that's beneficial for us. Post- September 11th, of
course, it had such a huge impact on so many people and so many
countries around he world, that brings a new focus, a new prism, if
you will, that we look through. So, clearly, we have an intense focus
on terrorism around the world and where it may be popping up and where
those cells might be. But all we're trying to do is bring some context
to this, not distance it or being it closer, is bring some context to
it.
Q: But -- we understand the context. So this is specific information
that there is an increase in al Qaeda activity or some other kind of
activity pertaining to terrorists post-9/11?
Clarke: I, for one, am just not going to put a lot of
characterizations on it. I think what we're doing now and this
proposal the two governments are looking at is a natural evolution of
what they were already doing.
Pace: Perhaps by trying to be precise, we're being too precise and
raising questions that really was not the intent. The helicopters were
a decision made that was exclusive of the global war on terrorism.
Q: I think we understand that.
Q: Torie, before you call it --
Q: Let him finish, please.
Pace: As we have increased our desire to be -- to cooperate with other
governments since 11 September, every place we have military members
working with foreign governments, of course, the global war on
terrorism and the local security environment do go hand in hand,
because you either have terrorists there now or you don't; and if you
have a strong security environment, it is less likely, then, if you
don't have terrorists, that ones will come. If you have a weak
security environment, it is more likely that terrorists will come. So
it's impossible for me to stand here and tell you that what we're
doing now in Georgia is either purely counterterrorist or purely not
counterterrorist. The fact of the matter is that as we help our
friends increase their own security capability, we are helping them in
the global war on terrorism and against other internal threats that
they may have. So I just can't quantify for you better than that.
Q: Before you call it in, to go to a different topic, Osama bin Laden,
the issue of his, reportedly, family maybe giving DNA samples, how
close is the military perhaps to determining who might have been
killed in the Zhawar Kili? What more can you say on that? Anything at
all that you can expand on that issue?
Clarke: I don't have anything new since what the secretary said
yesterday. I don't know if you do.
Q: But did you ask for DNA evidence from the family, as has been
reported?
Clarke: I don't know.
Pace: And I do not know. I do know we have some DNA samples from the
location of the strike. I do not know where we stand with DNA from --
Q: Would that be a Defense Department activity if you were to obtain
or seek to obtain DNA samples from family members, or would that be
another part of the government?
Pace: I'm not sure who would do that. I mean, I don't think the
Defense Department would be doing the DNA match, but I'd have to find
out for you who would do that.
Q: But you're not aware of any request by the government --
Clarke: I'm not.
Q: -- for DNA samples from Osama's family, Osama bin Laden's family?
Pace: It would surprise me if we haven't, but I'm not specifically
aware that we have.
Q: And could you elaborate on the samples that you were able to
obtain? Does it look like they were good enough samples that you'd be
able to match?
Pace: I don't know.
Clarke: Last one.
Q: Yeah. Many of the mil-to-mil upgrades we've seen in the region of
Central Asia or Eurasia, whatever you want to call it, Uzbekistan,
Kyrgystan, we've sort of looked at those as supporting Afghanistan
operations. Now, taking those two plus this possible one in Georgia,
should we be viewing those -- these things would be -- would have been
extraordinary a few years ago to even think about military -- U.S.
military substantial operations in those areas. How should we be
seeing those? Should we be seeing those as part of the war on
terrorism, or are they just focused on Afghanistan?
Pace: Which were you two other than Georgia? I'm sorry.
Q: Kyrgystan and Uzbekistan. (Inaudible) -- you know, fairly --
Pace: I think on the latter two, because of our operations in
Afghanistan, because they have been cooperative with us, it has opened
more doors for cooperation, so the global war on terrorism has opened
that particular door for us to talk to each other better. The
mil-to-mil cooperation is still, as I've said, a combination of what
kind of assistance can we provide that will assist you, friendly host
government, with your internal needs for your own uses? And by doing
so, we've recognized the fact that we're also strengthening your
ability to resist terrorism inside your country.
Clarke: Thank you.
Q: Thank.
Pace: Thanks.
(end transcript)
(Distributed by the Office of International Information Programs, U.S.
Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)
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