15 January 2002
Transcript: John Walker Lindh to Be Tried in Federal Court, Ashcroft Says
(Charged on four counts that could carry life sentence) (2770)
U.S. citizen John Walker Lindh, who trained with the al Qaeda
terrorist organization and fought alongside Taliban forces in
Afghanistan, is being brought back to the United States from a U.S.
military ship to stand trial in a U.S. federal court.
Walker is to be tried on four charges, including conspiracy to kill
U.S. nationals abroad, which carries a possible life sentence,
Attorney General John Ashcroft announced at a Justice Department news
conference in Washington January 15.
The criminal complaint, filed in the federal district court in
Alexandria, Virginia, also charges Walker with two counts of providing
material support or resources to terrorists, which could carry a
penalty of up to 15 years in prison, or a life sentence if death
resulted from the act.
The fourth count is for allegedly engaging in transactions with the
Taliban.
Ashcroft did not rule out the filing later of additional charges
against the defendant.
"The United States does not casually or capriciously charge one of its
own citizens with providing support to terrorists," Ashcroft said. "We
are compelled to do so today by the inescapable fact of September the
11th -- a day that reminded us in no uncertain terms that we have
enemies in the world and that these enemies seek to destroy us.
"We learned on September 11 that our way of life is not immune from
attack and even destruction. We have not overlooked attacks on America
when they are made by foreign nationals; we cannot overlook attacks on
America when they come from United States citizens."
Lindh, 20, was captured in November fighting with the Taliban in
Afghanistan. He was taken into custody by U.S. forces after a prison
uprising at a fortress in the northern Afghan city of Mazar-e Sharif.
The charges filed against Walker are based on voluntary statements
made by Walker himself, Ashcroft said.
The complaint, Ashcroft explained, alleges that Lindh "knowingly and
purposefully allied himself with terror; that he chose to embrace
fanatics, and his allegiance to them never faltered, not with the
knowledge they had murdered thousands of his countrymen; not with the
knowledge that they were engaged in a war with the United States; and
not, finally, in the prison uprising that took the life of CIA agent
Johnny Spann."
The U.S. military has been holding Lindh on a ship in the Arabian Sea.
He is now in the process of being transferred from military control to
control of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, Ashcroft said.
Following is the transcript of the news conference:
(begin transcript)
U.S. Department of Justice
Attorney General John Ashcroft Transcript
John Walker Lindh News Conference
DOJ Conference Center
January 15, 2002
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Good afternoon. Particularly, before I begin, I'd
like to thank Michael Chertoff for being with me, the head of the
Criminal Division, and Larry Thompson, whose duties have him in other
settings today, for their outstanding work in regard to the
announcement that I'll be making.
Today I am announcing the filing of criminal charges against John
Walker Lindh, an American citizen who was captured in Afghanistan
fighting for the Taliban. In a complaint filed in the U.S. District
Court for the Eastern District of Virginia -- and you all will get a
copy of this complaint, I think, available to you today at the close
of this particular meeting -- the United States is charging Walker
with the following crimes:
One, conspiracy to kill nationals of the United States of America
overseas; namely, U.S. nationals engaged in the conflict in
Afghanistan.
Two, providing material support and resources to designated Foreign
Terrorist Organizations, including al Qaeda.
And three, engaging in prohibited transactions with the Taliban.
If convicted of these charges, Walker could receive life imprisonment.
The United States does not casually or capriciously charge one of its
own citizens with providing support to terrorists. We are compelled to
do so today by the inescapable fact of September the 11th -- a day
that reminded us in no uncertain terms that we have enemies in the
world and that these enemies seek to destroy us. We learned on
September 11th that our way of life is not immune from attack and even
from destruction.
We have not overlooked attacks on America when they were made by
foreign nationals. We cannot overlook attacks on America when they
come from United States citizens.
As set forth in the complaint, the charges filed against Walker are
based on voluntary statements made by Walker himself. The complaint
alleges Walker knowingly and purposely allied himself with certain
terrorist organizations, with terror; that he chose to embrace
fanatics, and his allegiance to those fanatics and terrorists never
faltered, not even with the knowledge that they had murdered thousands
of his countrymen, not with the knowledge that they were engaged in a
war with the United States, and not, finally, in the prison uprising
that took the life of CI agent -- CIA agent Johnny Spann.
Walker is in the process of being transferred from the custody of the
United States military, where, by his own account, he was treated well
and received adequate food and medical treatment, to the custody of
the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
As the complaint states, prior to being interviewed by the FBI, Walker
was informed of his Miranda rights, including the right to speak to
counsel. He acknowledged that he understood each of his rights, and he
chose to waive them, both verbally and in a signed document. The
Department of Justice complaint based on Walker's statements in
interviews states that on or about May 2001, Walker joined a
paramilitary training camp run by the terrorist group Harkat
ul-Mujahedeen. After his training was completed, he was given a choice
to fight with the Harkat ul-Mujahedeen in Kashmir or join the Taliban
to fight in Afghanistan. Walker chose to join the Taliban.
He went to Afghanistan and presented himself to a Taliban recruitment
center, telling the individuals there that -- and I'm quoting --
quote, "he was a Muslim who wanted to go to the front lines to fight."
The complaint further states that because Walker's language skills
were deemed insufficient by Taliban recruiters, he was referred to
another group, which he was told was Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda
network.
When al Qaeda members told Walker he needed more military training to
join the terrorist group, the complaint sets forth Walker's admission
that he spent seven weeks in an al Qaeda camp, training in weapons,
explosives and battlefield combat. Walker reported that Osama bin
Laden visited the camp on three to five occasions. On one of these
occasions, Walker met personally with bin Laden, who, quote, according
to Walker, "thanked him for taking part in jihad."
According to the complaint, when his al Qaeda training was completed,
Walker -- again, by his own admission -- chose to go to the front
lines of the battle in Afghanistan.
Armed with an AKM rifle, he was sent to Kabul and eventually made it
to the frontline of the battle with the Northern Alliance in Takhar.
Walker told U.S. officials that he was aware of the attacks of
September the 11th and that Osama bin Laden had ordered the attacks.
But even after September the 11th, with full knowledge of the
thousands dead in the United States and al Qaeda's responsibility for
those deaths, the complaint states that Walker continued to fight for
the Taliban against American interests.
After he was taken prisoner in Mazar-e Sharif in November, Walker
refused to cooperate with U.S. officials and lied about his
citizenship. The criminal complaint filed today describes a series of
crossroads John Walker Lindh encountered on his way to joining not
just one, but two terrorist organizations. At each crossroad, Walker
faced a choice, and with each choice, he choose to ally himself with
terrorists. Drawn to South Asia, Walker chose to train with
terrorists. Trained as a terrorist, Walker chose more advanced
instructions from al Qaeda. Schooled by al Qaeda, Walker chose to
fight on the frontlines with America's enemies. Our complaint, based
on Walker's own words, is very clear: Terrorists did not compel John
Walker Lindh to join them; John Walker Lindh chose terrorists.
Walker was blessed to grow up in a country that cherishes freedom of
speech, religious tolerance, political democracy, and equality between
men and women. And yet he chose to reject these values in favor of
their antithesis, a regime that publicly and proudly advertised its
mission to extinguish freedom, enslave women, and deny education. John
Walker Lindh chose to fight with the Taliban, chose to train with al
Qaeda, and to be led by Osama bin Laden.
We may never know why he turned his back on our country and our
values, but we cannot ignore that he did. Youth is not absolution for
treachery, and personal self-discovery is not an excuse to take up
arms against one's country. Misdirected Americans cannot seek
direction in murderous ideologies and expect to avoid the
consequences.
Not all conduct against the United States by U.S. citizens is
susceptible to the charge of treason. The Constitution imposes a high
evidentiary burden to prove the charge of treason. Article III,
Section 3 of the Constitution requires that treason be proven only by
a confession in open court or by the testimony of at least two
witnesses to each alleged overt act. For now, we are confident in
going forward with the charges we've filed today.
And in the meantime, our investigation of Walker will continue. We
have not ruled out filing additional charges against him.
We in America have a country respected for cherishing freedom and
tolerating dissent. We have fought wars in defense of our freedom and
our right to criticize our government. And when criticism turns to
violence against these very values, we must once again defend our
nation. The United States Department of Justice will defend the values
reflected in our laws by prosecuting John Walker Lindh.
Thank you. Now I'll be happy to take questions. Yes, sir?
QUESTION: Attorney General, why are you charging him with a capital
crime, given everything you've just outlined?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: I think it's very clear, from the outline that I
have made, the crimes for which we believe the evidence now provides a
basis for making those charges, and that's the reason for which we are
charging those crimes.
Q: Attorney General, how much did you consult with President Bush
about this? And can you talk a little bit about the process of
consultation and so forth that led to this decision?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Well, very frankly, my consultations with the
president are a matter private to him, and he would be the only
individual eligible to comment on any consultations that I would have
with the president, if any. Thank you.
Q: Why isn't he a candidate for a military tribunal?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Well, Mr. John Walker Lindh is a U.S. citizen, and
according to the military order issued by the president, it's for
dealing with non-citizens of the United States.
Yeah?
Q: You said other charges would be considered. Does that mean he may
still be charged with treason and face the death penalty?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Yeah. If additional evidence is developed that
would provide a basis for other charges -- and I don't want to begin
an inventory of those charges at this time, but there could be a
variety of other things that might be developed -- then we would be
free to bring other charges against him.
Yes?
Q: Mr. Ashcroft, you said that he chose to go to the front lines to
fight against the Northern Alliance. Did he at any time -- is there
evidence that he at any time actually fought against any American
soldiers, servicemen?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: I think it's pretty clear that the complaint that
you will receive a copy of, if you haven't already, alleges that he
had knowledge of the American forces in the theater, that he was aware
that -- he personally was among troops being bombed by American forces
and knew that the participants in the conflict were not limited to
those individuals who we might normally consider members of the
Northern Alliance.
Yes?
Q: Taken together with the decision to bring Mr. Moussaoui to the
Eastern District of Virginia, can we now take this as a sign that all
of those who are charged in connection with the Afghanistan campaign
and the investigation of PENTBOMB will be brought to Alexandria for
trial? And might there be a trial with multiple defendants?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Let me just indicate that I think it's fair to say
that we will view these cases individually and measure the best
interests of the United States and consider the law which -- the law
regarding venue, which may provide a basis for different cases being
brought in different settings. So I wouldn't draw any conclusions. And
you said might there be multiple defendants. I don't think you should
indicate -- or judge from this case -- draw any conclusions related
from this Eastern Virginia -- charge that there would be multiple
defendants. Yes?
Q: We all saw the newsreels of the interviews with John Walker Lindh.
But it seems from the indictment that there were subsequent interviews
with him in which he acknowledged the same things that he was
interviewed about, about participating. Or did most of the basis for
the indictment come from those interviews?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: The basis for the indictment is from statements
made by John Walker Lindh to FBI investigators after he had, both
orally and in written form, acknowledged his rights and indicated his
understanding of those rights that had been provided to him by the FBI
investigators.
Yes, sir?
Q: Is there a formal process for transferring Mr. Walker from military
custody to the FBI, or is it just a matter of handing him over?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: I'm not going to be making comments about how the
particular custody arrangements of this particular case will be
undertaken or the particular time frames and locations in which they
will be undertaken.
Sir?
Q: Did he provide any information to the FBI that was helpful to the
investigation of al Qaeda or the September 11th attacks?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: I'm not going to comment on additional information
that might have been developed. The complaint, which will be available
to you, is significant, but it does not include an entire transcript
of those items which were the subject of the inquiries.
Yes, sir?
Q: Sir, even though he was "Mirandized," his family has complained
several times that they haven't had the chance to get his lawyer in to
talk to him yet. Do you know how soon his lawyer will have access to
him now that these charges have been filed?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: Well, I think it's important to understand that
the subject here is entitled to choose his own lawyer, and to our
knowledge, has not chosen a lawyer at this time. And as such, when he
is brought into the Eastern District for the process, which is
beginning today, he'll have every right to counsel.
Let's see, you haven't -- yes, ma'am?
Q: You said that Osama bin Laden had asked him and actually thanked
him for participating in a jihad. Can you comment on whether that was
before 9/11 or after 9/11?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: The complaint quotes Mr. John Walker Lindh as
having met with Osama bin Laden and saying that Osama bin Laden
thanked him for participating in jihad. I'm not confident now that I
could say at which particular juncture in the time line that was
undertaken.
Yes, ma'am?
Q: Could you comment on the tone of his remarks to the FBI, his
statements? Was he remorseful at all or does he remain pretty defiant
about his involvement with al Qaeda?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: I can't comment on that and I probably wouldn't --
(laughing) -- but I can't.
Yes, ma'am?
Q: When do you expect him to be arraigned?
ATTY GEN. ASHCROFT: It's -- we're going to act promptly in this
matter, but I think it's impossible at this time to be able to strike
clear and definitive time lines.
Thank you very much.
(end transcript)
(Distributed by the Office of International Information Programs, U.S.
Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)
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