04 November 2001
Transcript: Rumsfeld Says Taliban Functioning As Military Force Only
(Secretary of Defense briefs after talks with Pakistani leaders)
(2520)
The Taliban is functioning in Afghanistan only as a military force --
there is no effective government in the country currently -- says U.S.
Secretary Defense Donald Rumsfeld.
Speaking to reporters November 4 after meeting in Islamabad with
Pakistan's President Pervez Musharraf and other Pakistani leaders,
Rumsfeld said the Taliban of course retain military capabilities.
"They have weapons and they are using their power in enclaves
throughout the country to impose their will on the Afghan people," he
said.
Rumsfeld said the Taliban are using mosques for ammunition storage,
command and control and meeting places. "They are putting tanks and
artillery pieces in close proximity to hospitals, schools, and
residential areas. And they are actively lying about civilian
casualties taking place in the country."
Rumsfeld said reports that the United States is bombing cities in
Afghanistan are not true. While acknowledging that "there is a lot of
ordnance flying around in Afghanistan," he said it is coming not only
from U.S. planes but also from Taliban and opposition artillery, and
the cause of damage is not always clear. U.S. planes are aiming for
military targets, and "we have been as careful as humanly possible,"
he said of the U.S. bombing campaign. "I don't think that ever in the
history of the world has there been a bombing effort that has been
done with the precision and the care and the attention to that issue."
Pakistan's Foreign Minister Abdul Sattar said at the briefing that
"the formation of a broad-based multi-ethnic government through a
home-grown process under the aegis of the United Nations appears
indispensable for bringing the travail of the people of Afghanistan to
an early end."
Rumsfeld this also is the goal of the United States. He noted that
U.S. Ambassador Richard Haass has been designated to work with the
U.N., the neighboring countries, and the non-Taliban, non-al-Qaeda
interests within Afghanistan, to find a way to form a broadly based
government that would refuse to harbor terrorists.
Pakistan was the fourth stop for Rumsfeld on a five-nation trip
November 2-4 that also included visits to Russia, Tajikistan,
Uzbekistan and India.
Following is a transcript of the Islamabad briefing:
(begin transcript)
United States Department of Defense
NEWS TRANSCRIPT
Presenter: Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld
November 4, 2001
Secretary Rumsfeld Media Availability with Pakistani Foreign Minister
(Media availability with Pakistani Foreign Minister Abdul Sattar,
Islamabad, Pakistan)
Sattar: Ladies and gentlemen of the media, the U.S. secretary of
defense on arrival told us that he is on a leisurely trip to five
countries over the weekend. But let me say that President Pervez
Musharraf and the members of the delegation that have had the
privilege of listening to the secretary of defense are delighted that
he found time during his whirlwind tour to come and have talks with
us.
I wish particularly to recall that when I went to Washington in June,
the secretary of defense did me the honor of receiving me at the
Pentagon and I detected in him a person who remembers the decade of
the 1980's when our two countries were very closely cooperating on an
issue of world importance. More than that, we get the feeling that he
shares, that Mr. Rumsfeld shares, our hopes for the resuscitation of
our cooperation on a durable basis.
President Pervez Musharraf and Secretary Rumsfeld have exchanged
information and views on the situation in Afghanistan. They also
discussed the desirability of evolving a political strategy on a fast
track so as to facilitate the realization of the objectives of the
U.N. Security Council resolutions in as short a time as possible. The
formation of a broad-based multi-ethnic government through a
home-grown process under the aegis of the United Nations appears
indispensable for bringing the travail of the people of Afghanistan to
an early end. Keeping in view of the interests of the people of
Afghanistan, such a government would implement the U.N. Security
Council resolutions.
President Musharraf also underlined the need for continuation of
humanitarian relief for the distressed Afghan people inside their own
country so as to reduce the displacement of Afghans outside their
country. Secretary Rumsfeld recalled that the U.S. is the largest
donor for relief of Afghans inside and outside the country.
Let me conclude by saying that we regard Secretary Rumsfeld's visit to
Islamabad as an important step in the development of cooperation and
deepening of goodwill between Pakistan and the United States. With
these few words I hand over the mike to the Honorable Donald Rumsfeld.
Rumsfeld: Mr. Minister, thank you very much. I certainly appreciate
those generous remarks. It's a pleasure to be back in Pakistan after a
good many years. I used to travel here as a businessman and it's
certainly is a delight to see you after our visit in Washington, D.C.
As the minister indicated, the president and his senior officials and
our delegation had a very wide-ranging discussion. We did indeed talk
a good deal about the importance of humanitarian relief in Afghanistan
and the very serious plight of the Afghan people that has been brought
about by the Taliban and the al Qaeda conflicts.
The determination that we have as a country in the United States to
aggressively root out the terrorists that have killed so many
thousands of people and who are threatening to kill so many thousands
more. The president of the United States is determined on this matter.
He will see it through and let there be no doubt about that.
We as a country and I as an individual and a government official very
much value the relationship with Pakistan; the cooperative way that
they have approached the battle against terrorism and the assistance
that they have provided. We recognize it, we appreciate it, and along
with the dozens and dozens of countries across the globe who share the
concern about the terrorist problem in this world, I thank them and
would be happy to respond to questions.
Q: President Musharraf has repeatedly talked about an excess of hope
for suspension of military operations, if they are not over, in the
month of Ramadhan. Was this issue discussed today and what are your
views on this?
Rumsfeld: I'm certainly aware of the views of the president of
Pakistan and indeed the views of any number of countries across the
globe. It is an important question and certainly an issue that all of
us are sensitive to. The reality is that the threats of additional
terrorist acts are there. They are credible, they are real, and they
offer the prospects of still thousands of more people being killed.
Our task is to certainly be sensitive to the views in the region, but
also to see that we aggressively deal with the terrorist networks that
exist, and beyond that, I would simply say that we do not really want
to discuss precisely how we're going to handle the period ahead other
than to say that it is important that the terrorists be stopped.
Q: Mr. Rumsfeld, would you give us your assessment of the Taliban at
this moment as a military force and Mr. Sattar will you respond to the
reported remarks of Osama bin Ladin that Muslim leaders who cooperate
with the United Nations are in someway infidels?
Sattar: Actually, Osama bin Ladin?
Q: Made a recorded statement on al-Jazeera yesterday saying that any
Muslim leader who works with the UN is an infidel.
Sattar: Well, I can tell you the views of the government of Pakistan.
We have ever since our independence attached the highest importance to
the United Nations and we have always called for the implementation of
the resolutions of the Security Council. You know the background to
that. We attach great importance to the U.N. Security Council
resolutions and anyone who does not is on the other side.
Rumsfeld: Taliban is not really functioning as a government as such.
There really is not a government to speak of in Afghanistan today. As
a military force they have concentrations of power that exist. They
have capabilities that remain. They have tanks and anti-aircraft. They
undoubtedly have some Stinger surface-to-air missiles and portable.
They have weapons and they are using their power in enclaves
throughout the country to impose their will on the Afghan people. They
are not making major military moves if that is the import of your
question. They are pretty much in static positions. They are using
mosques for ammunition storage areas. They are using mosques for
command and control and meeting places. They are putting tanks and
artillery pieces in close proximity to hospitals, schools, and
residential areas. And they are actively lying about civilian
casualties taking place in the country. I think that probably gives
you a sense of what I have to say on the Taliban.
Sattar: May I just add one point. We have greatly valued the
information given to us by the secretary of defense of the United
States that never in history has so much care been taken as at present
by the United States to reduce civilian casualties to the minimum
possible. And I think this statement is extremely valuable in view of
the news that we see everyday alleging increasing civilian casualties
in Afghanistan.
Rumsfeld: May I just add one thought? It is always a shock to me to
turn on the television and see a banner or a hear a voice saying that
the United States is bombing Kabul or bombing Kandahar. That is not
true. There is a lot of ordnance flying around in Afghanistan, let
there be no doubt, and the United States is aggressively trying to go
after the Taliban and the al Qaeda, and their military forces. And we
intend to continue to do that. But the ordinance is coming to be sure
from the air down, it is also coming from the ground up and it is also
coming from opposition forces fighting in certain locations around the
country with the Taliban.
When there is damage done, it is not always exactly clear what caused
the damage and to have pictures of artillery being fired in the air
and saying someone is bombing Kabul, the United States bombs military
targets every time we can find one, except when they're in close
proximity to very densely populated residential areas, and then, of
course, we have to recognize the potential for collateral damage and
so as the minister says, we have been as careful as humanly possible.
I don't think that ever in the history of the world has there been a
bombing effort that has been done with the precision and the care and
the attention to that issue.
Q: Mr. Minister, what concerns did you express to the United States
about the bombing campaign in Afghanistan. Is Pakistan concerned that
the U.S. has said it might keep bombing through Ramadhan. Is Pakistan
concerned about the close relationship between the United States and
the Northern Alliance?
Sattar: The president of Pakistan has very candidly shared with the
secretary the concern over reporting that we see in the media -- day
in and day out -- alleging increasing civilian casualties in
Afghanistan and as I said I anticipated your question and the
secretary also has given you a very detailed answer on the exceptional
care that has been exercised by the United States to spare and prevent
civilian casualties.
Q: But sir, on the question, the president of Pakistan has said he
would like this to end quickly. The U.S. has said there is going to be
bombing as long as it takes. Is there a common opinion?
Sattar: No, I think the secretary was already aware before he landed
in Islamabad about the remark that the president of Pakistan has made
namely that the military campaign should be reduced to a time as short
as possible consistent with the realizations of the objectives. And
that is the position; he was already aware. We did not therefore go
into any great detail.
Rumsfeld: And I can assure you that's the position of the United
States of America. We would like to see it end as quickly as possible,
too. There is no one who favors a long process. We need to do what
needs to be done. We're aggressively trying to do what needs to be
done and we intend to end up having done what needs to be done.
Q: Mr. Minister, is Pakistan concerned about the Northern Alliance
gaining control in Afghanistan? And, if so, can you characterize that
concern?
Sattar: For the sake of stability in Afghanistan it is extremely
important that the government in that country should be broad-based,
multi-ethnic and representative of the demography of Afghanistan. I
think the secretary will perhaps wish to say a few things on this
point but my perception on the basis of the conversations that have
been held today is that the United States too seeks to support the
process for the formation of a broad-based, multi-ethnic government
under the aegis of the United Nations.
Rumsfeld: That is exactly correct. That is the position of the United
States of America. Secretary Powell has addressed this; President Bush
has addressed it; a U.S. representative, Mr. Richard Haass, Ambassador
Haass, has been designated to work with the U.N. to work with the
neighboring countries, to work with the interests within Afghanistan,
the non-Taliban, non-al-Qaeda interests and to find a way that out of
that process can come a government that would be broadly based and
that would be not willing to harbor terrorists and to try to terrorize
either their neighbors, their people, or the rest of the world.
Sattar: The Secretary is traveling in telescope time, so one more
question.
Q: (Partially audible) President Pervez Musharraf has said that there
are three strategies: a military strategy, a political strategy, and a
rehabilitation and reconstruction strategy. How prepared America is to
carry out that rehabilitation strategy?
Rumsfeld: To carry out the other two pieces of the strategy? Yes,
there is no question. The United States was the largest donor of food
before September 11 terrorist attack on New York and Washington at
something like 170 million dollars prior to September 11. The
president of the United States has already announced 320 million
dollar humanitarian effort for Afghanistan even though the terrorists
and the Taliban are still involved.
There is no question but that the United States as a country that
cares about the Afghan people and wants to see the circumstance of
those people improved, would be a willing partner in a post-Taliban
rehabilitation process.
Sattar: One sentence I wish to add that the president of Pakistan has
also apprised Secretary Rumsfeld of our concerns with reference to
Kashmir and also informed him of the stringent measures that have
taken by the government of Pakistan to insure custodial security of
our strategic assets. Thank you very much.
Rumsfeld: Thank you.
(end transcript)
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