Homeland Security

DATE=3/6/03

TYPE=INTERVIEW TRANSCRIPT

TITLE=ROBERT OSTERGARD

NUMBER=3-574

BYLINE=TOM CROSBY

DATELINE=WASHINGTON

CONTENT=

/// EDITORS: THIS INTERVIEW IS AVAILABLE IN DALET UNDER SOD/ENGLISH NEWS NOW INTERVIEWS IN THE FOLDER FOR TODAY OR YESTERDAY ///

OPEN: U-S officials are hoping to get a wealth of information from two alleged al-Qaida leaders captured in Pakistan Saturday...Khalid Shaikh Mohammed and Mustafa Ahmed Hawsawi. Khalid Shaikh Mohammed is believed to have had a hand in the September 11th 2001 terrorist attacks in the United States. Mustafa Ahmed Hawsawi is...according to published reports...named in some U-S and is thought to have been the paymaster responsible for financing the September 11th hijackings.

Robert Ostergard is a terrorism expert at Binghamton University in New York, and he tells News Now's Tom Crosby these arrests could not have come at a better time for President Bush:

MR. OSTERGARD: It's certainly an important development for the Bush administration, given how things are transpiring with its efforts with Iraq. The criticism coming against the administration was that it was focusing on Iraq at the expense of the war on terrorism in Afghanistan. But these arrests really do give it sort of a refocus on the war on terrorism. And it's important for the administration to keep that emphasis on this at the same time while pursuing its Iraq policy.

It's also an intelligence treasure trove. If they're able to get Khalid Shaikh Mohammed to speak and to open up about what it is he does know, then we're looking at really a major blow to the organizational structure and the future plans of al-Qaida.

MR. CROSBY: It also appears they apprehended Mustafa Ahmed [al-]Hisawi, a Saudi native, who apparently was involved in financing some of al-Qaida's operations, too.

MR. OSTERGARD: Right. And this is an important part for the United States. One of the issues in dealing with an organization like al-Qaida is not just targeting militarily and trying to take out its leadership, trying to arrest its leadership, or trying to destabilize its camps or anything like that, but where al-Qaida draws a lot of its strength from is the financing. And what they're going to be able to draw from him is, additionally, how al-Qaida's financing has been constructed over the years. That becomes important because that's a long-term solution to fighting this sort of internationalized terrorism. Because al-Qaida wouldn't exist in such a strong way if it didn't have the type of money behind it that it does.

MR. CROSBY: Bob, will there be a problem when it comes to prosecuting these people? In other words, will we finally see the military tribunals that President Bush talked about so long ago coming into effect?

MR. OSTERGARD: Yes, I don't think that the administration has any choice. There is no way that the administration is going to put these people into a public trial. The military tribunals are probably going to be the way that the administration is going to move in prosecuting these people.

Also, for a number of security reasons as well, the administration is, of course, concerned about protecting Khalid Shaikh Mohammed and what it is he does know. From different sources that we've been able to pick up, there is word that certainly has come out that because of Khalid Shaikh Mohammed's arrest, there is potentially a price on his head; that bin Laden and the other members of al-Qaida are willing to potentially assassinate him instead of allowing him to just spill his guts about what it is he knows about al-Qaida. So, there is definite security concerns and they don't want this to be a public trial, given the type of information that is involved here.

MR. CROSBY: Is there a possibility, though, in your mind that perhaps he is not spilling his guts, as you put it, but that officials want people to think that's what's happening?

MR. OSTERGARD: Well, there is certainly that potential. And it was very, very quick after the arrest -- and it did sort of make you wonder a little bit -- very quick after the arrest that the United States announced that they're getting all this wonderful information from Khalid Shaikh Mohammed. We know that he has gone through resistance training, and the type of interrogation techniques the United States is going to use is probably going to take a little bit longer to wear on somebody.

On the other hand, at this point, it would seem that it is going to be in Mohammed's best interest to cooperate, particularly given what the United States already knows about him. And that is going to be added pressure for him to eventually start giving out the additional information that they want. Whether he has been doing it already I think is probably more propaganda than actual fact right now.

MR. CROSBY: Bob, another thing that has been cropping up here too is we have had reports that a mosque in New York City was helping a cleric there raise millions of dollars, we're told, to finance terrorism. That, too, apparently has been shut down, but that also raises some very interesting questions and problems, doesn't it?

MR. OSTERGARD: It certainly does. One of the main elements that the United States is going to try to get from these two latest captives is the linkages that al-Qaida has to cells within the United States. And the funding coming from mosques and nonprofit groups in the United States has been a real concern for U.S. officials mainly because it's really sort of a way of looking into the United States and a way of these people I guess having an in that the United States is very concerned about. The financing issue coming from mosques and nonprofits has been an ongoing issue for years and the United States has tried to stop it.

The problem is that, in some cases, there is very little known in terms of who is actually diverting the money or how many people were involved in it. These may be legitimate organizations, legitimate mosques, and it may be one person who is diverting the money, and the rest of the people who are donating to the organization or to the mosque know absolutely nothing about it. So, there is concern about the legitimacy of Islamic charities, the mosques, but also, from a security perspective, the United States is very concerned about what it is these people are also conveying to them besides money.

CLOSE: Robert Ostergard, a terrorism expert and associate director of the Institute of Global Cultural Studies at Binghamton University in New York.

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