‘Countdown: Iraq’ for Nov. 21

‘Countdown: Iraq’ for Nov. 21, 2002

ANNOUNCER: Tonight: a breaking story. U.S. officials nab one of Osama bin Laden’s top al Qaeda commanders. See the impact this will have on America’s war on terror.
Plus, images from space. See how hundreds of satellite images could help President Bush make his case against Saddam.
And the shot seen and heard around the world. COUNTDOWN talks to a man who covered the Gulf War live from Baghdad.
This is America’s news channel, MSNBC. From Washington, the Persian Gulf and around the world, the most comprehensive hour on the showdown with Saddam. This is COUNTDOWN: IRAQ. Here is Lester Holt.
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HOLT: Dawna Friesen tonight.
As inspection work gets underway, the U.S. and Iraq will be waging a war of images, using satellite photos to make the case for inspectors and the public. Public companies like Icys (ph) Online and Globalsecurity.org are going one step further, putting those images directly on the Web for people to judge for themselves.
David Albright is a former U.N. weapons inspector and president of the Institute for Science and International Security, which has such a Web site. He join us from Washington. Mr. Albright, thanks for joining us.
DAVID ALBRIGHT, FMR. U.N. WEAPONS INSPECTOR: Thank you.
HOLT: This image right here on the screen right now I believe is the Taji (ph) missile fabrication plant. It shows the new construction after the destruction of one of the previous bombing strikes. What’s the value of a photo like that? Especially when it’s out in the public view and the Iraqis see what you see.
ALBRIGHT: Well, what the value is, is that it gives you some heads-up on what’s going on. And remember, there haven’t been inspectors there in four years. And so commercial satellite imagery has been very important for the public and the inspection agencies to use to try understand what Iraq is doing at it’s sensitive military sites.
HOLT: And during the four years that inspectors have been out of Iraq, have those satellite images given a fair amount of information as to where things are and where they’re going?
ALBRIGHT: It’s very hard to form definitive judgments about anything about Iraq’s WMD (ph) programs. But it gives you tips on where you may want to look when you can get back into the country. It’s not conclusive evidence, by any means, but you’re trying to find tips that allow you to focus some of your inspection efforts, and so you would want to look at those buildings.
HOLT: I want to put up another image if we can. It’s of what is a suspected nuclear facility of some kind. I believe it’s in Tuwaitha (ph) is the name of the location. It shows new construction. Has that been one of the things that has put the inspectors on the course that they’re now on, looking at those spots that have been under construction?
ALBRIGHT: They’ll certainly visit Tuwaitha. I mean Tuwaitha was the central facility for Iraq’s nuclear program for many years and from which the nuclear weapons program dispersed around the country. And so any activity at Tuwaitha that’s new is going to be looked at very closely to ensure that these nuclear scientists that remain there are not trying to do anything that’s banned.
HOLT: And I think we have a photo of 1991 of that same facility when it was struck by allied bombers. It shows the various buildings that were destroyed. When you encounter those kinds of places that were destroyed during the war, did you ever really know what was there? Or did you have to take it on the intelligence that the U.S. gave you?
ALBRIGHT: Well, a lot was learned by interviewing Iraqis. One of the things that’s interesting about that photo was that that kind of photo was not available to the International Atomic Energy Agency prior to the Gulf War or the public. And that photo, if seen by the public, could have very well led to much more pressure to intensify the inspections on Iraq in the late 1980’s and led to uncovering the program earlier.
So, in that sense, these photos can provide the public and the media with an ability to investigate what’s going on in totalitarian states and to build public pressure for greater scrutiny of those states.
HOLT: Do you think it has made the Iraqis better, however, at hiding weapons of mass destruction? The knowledge that you can get such detailed photos commercially?
ALBRIGHT: It certainly does. And I mean, there’s a downside to this. I mean, not only does it allow countries to study how to camouflage better, because they can by the satellite imagery themselves, it can also be used by countries to target other countries. And so it’s a dual use technology.
HOLT: All right. David Albright, good to have you on. Thanks for joining us tonight.
ALBRIGHT: Sure. Thank you.
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HOLT: We promised to answer your questions on the showdown with Saddam Hussein. Karen writes about weapons inspections, “Would underground facilities be detectable? And, if so, are they going to check every square mile in the country?” Well, Karen, here’s your answer.
ALBRIGHT: If the inspectors implement a program to look for underground facilities, there are many tools that they can use to find such facilities, using commercial satellite imagery, underground penetrating radar. They have a good chance of finding such facilities. They also don’t to have look everywhere.
Finally, if you’re going to build a facility, you need roads, you need electricity and you need people. And that means that there’s clear indicators of where Iraq will have such activity.
HOLT: David Albright, former U.N. Weapons Inspector in Iraq. If you have questions for the COUNTDOWN, e-mail us at countdown@msnbc.com.
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